SA Footy

Grahaml wrote:

kickinit wrote:

Sorry Dude wrote:I do believe him when he says he wants to be part of a successful club, but the almight $$$ will speak very loud when it's all said and done. In all honesty though, (crows bias aside) are Geelong going to be in a better position to win a flag before the crows before the above mentioned players move on? Yes they have kids coming through, but the talent that is going to be on the move is very talented.

Geelong will still be in a better position. Even with those players gone Geelong still have a better list then the crows.

You lose quality and the pack closes in fast. Crows have the top end talent, just need them to fit together better and improve the depth. Far easier than trying to pick up AA calibre talent.

The difference between Geelong and the crows are miles apart. Your club champion Talia said it himself early this year that the crows had no depth.

kickinit wrote:

Grahaml wrote:

kickinit wrote:

Sorry Dude wrote:I do believe him when he says he wants to be part of a successful club, but the almight $$$ will speak very loud when it's all said and done. In all honesty though, (crows bias aside) are Geelong going to be in a better position to win a flag before the crows before the above mentioned players move on? Yes they have kids coming through, but the talent that is going to be on the move is very talented.

Geelong will still be in a better position. Even with those players gone Geelong still have a better list then the crows.

You lose quality and the pack closes in fast. Crows have the top end talent, just need them to fit together better and improve the depth. Far easier than trying to pick up AA calibre talent.

The difference between Geelong and the crows are miles apart. Your club champion Talia said it himself early this year that the crows had no depth.

It is currently. Compared to Geelong I don't rate the Crows as of now. I think the we have a lot more upside going forward as we only need to fix holes as there is already the experience in most key positions in the team.
Still a LONG way to go before we will contest for a flag, but I am confident we will not "bottom out" ala Port from a few years ago.

The difference is in the club culture. Ever since 2007 when the Cats drew a line in the sand and set a standard the players drafted to the club have toed the line and that's where the success has come. The same mantra Port has now about never giving up. You look at a couple of finals games this year with both teams 30 points down with 10 minutes to play and almost snatching victory. Look at the Crows losing 7 games by 2 goals or less and that's where the difference is.

Frosty wrote:The difference is in the club culture. Ever since 2007 when the Cats drew a line in the sand and set a standard the players drafted to the club have toed the line and that's where the success has come. The same mantra Port has now about never giving up. You look at a couple of finals games this year with both teams 30 points down with 10 minutes to play and almost snatching victory. Look at the Crows losing 7 games by 2 goals or less and that's where the difference is.

You've just given an example with 0 wins and 9 losses lol (understand your point though)

Yep it's a pretty fair assessment.

kickinit wrote:

Grahaml wrote:

kickinit wrote:

Sorry Dude wrote:I do believe him when he says he wants to be part of a successful club, but the almight $$$ will speak very loud when it's all said and done. In all honesty though, (crows bias aside) are Geelong going to be in a better position to win a flag before the crows before the above mentioned players move on? Yes they have kids coming through, but the talent that is going to be on the move is very talented.

Geelong will still be in a better position. Even with those players gone Geelong still have a better list then the crows.

You lose quality and the pack closes in fast. Crows have the top end talent, just need them to fit together better and improve the depth. Far easier than trying to pick up AA calibre talent.

The difference between Geelong and the crows are miles apart. Your club champion Talia said it himself early this year that the crows had no depth.

Didn't feel like reading what I said? Your comment only reinforces mine. Lol. Depth always looks very different when the 21st player has to be the 16th player and that's what Geelong are going to find in a couple of years. So far they've done it superbly, but one day those youngsters won't be able to step up.

Us, Carlton and the Crows are very even. And that's this year. The difference in my view, was the experienced players knowing how to win the close ones. Carlton hasn't had this for quite a few years and the Crows were wanting in this area as well. You simply can't allow yourself to be beaten by Melbourne and both clubs shouldn't have done so.

I think moving forward (next two or three years) Geelong and Adelaide have the same chance as winning the flag as each other. Zero.

regards,

REB

Frosty wrote:The difference is in the club culture. Ever since 2007 when the Cats drew a line in the sand and set a standard the players drafted to the club have toed the line and that's where the success has come. The same mantra Port has now about never giving up. You look at a couple of finals games this year with both teams 30 points down with 10 minutes to play and almost snatching victory. Look at the Crows losing 7 games by 2 goals or less and that's where the difference is.

Unfortunately Frosty I fear the culture of 2007 has eroded away with the retirement or loss of leaders Ottens, Ling, Harley, Chapman and Scarlett. The discipline hasn't been there since the start of 2012. We appear to be quite an arrogant group these days that spends far too much time worrying about the umpires instead of focussing on the contest. Our gameplan, for what it is, is predictable and our approach again is arrogant..meaning that we continue to serve up a predicatable game plan just thinking it is good enough to win. I don't believe the honesty is with the team leaders as it used to be.

We need to move a few on and get some new blood in with Scotty in the coaches box. We don't have the team demographic to continue playing the way we do and expect to win premierships.

regards,

REB

My concern is Geelong bringing in more mercenary free agents and undermining the winning culture and mentality that has been in place for the last 8 years. At least with the draft you can select young players who tick all the boxes based on their mental strength as well as physical, whereas players like Clark and Frawley may well be damaged goods.

Frosty wrote:My concern is Geelong bringing in more mercenary free agents and undermining the winning culture and mentality that has been in place for the last 8 years. At least with the draft you can select young players who tick all the boxes based on their mental strength as well as physical, whereas players like Clark and Frawley may well be damaged goods.

Not that keen on either of these blokes. Also not that keen on some of Wells' recent efforts. We took Hamling before Brad Hill a few years ago and Hill is killing them and Hamling might get the arse this summer. It's time for Mitch Brown to go..he's had six years and Burbury is a real worry as well. Going to be some tough seasons ahead for the Catters I reckon but yeah, no to Frawley, Clark and even Danger. Grow our own, develop our own, we've done well with this in the past.

regards,

REB

Rik E Boy wrote:

Frosty wrote:My concern is Geelong bringing in more mercenary free agents and undermining the winning culture and mentality that has been in place for the last 8 years. At least with the draft you can select young players who tick all the boxes based on their mental strength as well as physical, whereas players like Clark and Frawley may well be damaged goods.

Not that keen on either of these blokes. Also not that keen on some of Wells' recent efforts. We took Hamling before Brad Hill a few years ago and Hill is killing them and Hamling might get the arse this summer. It's time for Mitch Brown to go..he's had six years and Burbury is a real worry as well. Going to be some tough seasons ahead for the Catters I reckon but yeah, no to Frawley, Clark and even Danger. Grow our own, develop our own, we've done well with this in the past.

regards,

REB

Your success had a fair leg up with an unusually high amount of talented Father/son picks. They've dried up now and its back to the ability of your scouts to draft like every other club and they have been found out

Off topic, but seeing as we are talking lists. People can bitch and moan about COLA as much as they want, but I think Sydney have done an amazing job based on this

This is who is lining up tomorrow and what Sydney have done well in blooding their draft picks and drafting players to their needs.

7 Ex-Swans Rookies -
Harry Cunningham
Heath Grundy
Jake Lloyd
Mike Pyke
Dane Rampe
Kieren Jack (All-Australian)
Nick Smith (All-Australian)

5 x 30-plus in the draft -
Dan Hannebery (30)
Nick Malceski (64)
Luke Parker (40)
Sam Reid (38)
Adam Goodes (43).

Only Jarrad McVeigh (5), Gary Rohan (6) and Lewis Jetta (14) were Sydney first-round picks.
and
Four players trades from other clubs - Rhyce Shaw, Josh Kennedy, Ted Richards and Ben McGlynn (another ex-rookie)

Agree with the Father/Sons to some extent but we also peaked at the right time because the expansion clubs coming in over the last few years have taken a high percentage of the top draft picks meaning the lower ranked clubs had less opportunity to get access to those youngsters and start pulling themselves up the ladder.
Burbury is already gone along with a few others so I think the Cats will be quite active in draft and trade periods this year where we've been a bit quiet over the last few years - probably because the draft concessions are over for GC and GWS.

Sorry Dude wrote:Off topic, but seeing as we are talking lists. People can bitch and moan about COLA as much as they want, but I think Sydney have done an amazing job based on this

This is who is lining up tomorrow and what Sydney have done well in blooding their draft picks and drafting players to their needs.

7 Ex-Swans Rookies -
Harry Cunningham
Heath Grundy
Jake Lloyd
Mike Pyke
Dane Rampe
Kieren Jack (All-Australian)
Nick Smith (All-Australian)

5 x 30-plus in the draft -
Dan Hannebery (30)
Nick Malceski (64)
Luke Parker (40)
Sam Reid (38)
Adam Goodes (43).

Only Jarrad McVeigh (5), Gary Rohan (6) and Lewis Jetta (14) were Sydney first-round picks.
and
Four players trades from other clubs - Rhyce Shaw, Josh Kennedy, Ted Richards and Ben McGlynn (another ex-rookie)

...Kurt Tippett, Lance Franklin.

Booney wrote:

Sorry Dude wrote:Off topic, but seeing as we are talking lists. People can bitch and moan about COLA as much as they want, but I think Sydney have done an amazing job based on this

This is who is lining up tomorrow and what Sydney have done well in blooding their draft picks and drafting players to their needs.

7 Ex-Swans Rookies -
Harry Cunningham
Heath Grundy
Jake Lloyd
Mike Pyke
Dane Rampe
Kieren Jack (All-Australian)
Nick Smith (All-Australian)

5 x 30-plus in the draft -
Dan Hannebery (30)
Nick Malceski (64)
Luke Parker (40)
Sam Reid (38)
Adam Goodes (43).

Only Jarrad McVeigh (5), Gary Rohan (6) and Lewis Jetta (14) were Sydney first-round picks.
and
Four players trades from other clubs - Rhyce Shaw, Josh Kennedy, Ted Richards and Ben McGlynn (another ex-rookie)

...Kurt Tippett, Lance Franklin.

Both technically weren't traded, but I get your point and those 2 would be filling up most of the COLA glasses.

Add Craig Bird at pick 59 in the 2007 draft

Sorry Dude wrote:

Booney wrote:

Sorry Dude wrote:Off topic, but seeing as we are talking lists. People can bitch and moan about COLA as much as they want, but I think Sydney have done an amazing job based on this

This is who is lining up tomorrow and what Sydney have done well in blooding their draft picks and drafting players to their needs.

7 Ex-Swans Rookies -
Harry Cunningham
Heath Grundy
Jake Lloyd
Mike Pyke
Dane Rampe
Kieren Jack (All-Australian)
Nick Smith (All-Australian)

5 x 30-plus in the draft -
Dan Hannebery (30)
Nick Malceski (64)
Luke Parker (40)
Sam Reid (38)
Adam Goodes (43).

Only Jarrad McVeigh (5), Gary Rohan (6) and Lewis Jetta (14) were Sydney first-round picks.
and
Four players trades from other clubs - Rhyce Shaw, Josh Kennedy, Ted Richards and Ben McGlynn (another ex-rookie)

...Kurt Tippett, Lance Franklin.

Both technically weren't traded, but I get your point and those 2 would be filling up most of the COLA glasses.

Incorrect. Sydney pay their players to the standard salary cap, it is the AFL who pay the players the COLA on top.

daysofourlives wrote:Your success had a fair leg up with an unusually high amount of talented Father/son picks. They've dried up now and its back to the ability of your scouts to draft like every other club and they have been found out

I would suggest that you've forgotten about the part about 'developing' our own as you trot out a typically anti-Geelong myth that so many of you Hawks are keen about. The only player who was obviously going to be a gun that we got under the odds was Tom Hawkins. Let's have a look at some of the others.

Gary Ablett Jnr - Best player in the league now but not even close to that for the first five years of his career. Geelong had four seasons of him at his prime, a period that has now almost been matched by Gold Coast.
Matty Scarlett - Flogged in his first game and something of a comedy figure early on developed into the premier full back of the game during his career.
Mark Blake - Good at taps but pretty much useless everywhere else. Punted after 99 games, perhaps unluckily so.
Marc Woolnough - Did a knee. 2 games.
Nathan Ablett - Lost the plot and pissed off after only a couple of seasons
Donahue - Don't even remember his first name because he never played a game
David Clarke - spud, moved on.

Not all of those players kicked on, some pissed off. We won the 2011 Grand Final with just two of them. Nice try.

regards,

REB

Rik E Boy wrote:

daysofourlives wrote:Your success had a fair leg up with an unusually high amount of talented Father/son picks. They've dried up now and its back to the ability of your scouts to draft like every other club and they have been found out

I would suggest that you've forgotten about the part about 'developing' our own as you trot out a typically anti-Geelong myth that so many of you Hawks are keen about. The only player who was obviously going to be a gun that we got under the odds was Tom Hawkins. Let's have a look at some of the others.

Gary Ablett Jnr - Best player in the league now but not even close to that for the first five years of his career. Geelong had four seasons of him at his prime, a period that has now almost been matched by Gold Coast.
Matty Scarlett - Flogged in his first game and something of a comedy figure early on developed into the premier full back of the game during his career.
Mark Blake - Good at taps but pretty much useless everywhere else. Punted after 99 games, perhaps unluckily so.
Marc Woolnough - Did a knee. 2 games.
Nathan Ablett - Lost the plot and pissed off after only a couple of seasons
Donahue - Don't even remember his first name because he never played a game
David Clarke - spud, moved on.

Not all of those players kicked on, some pissed off. We won the 2011 Grand Final with just two of them. Nice try.

regards,

REB

Two pretty good ones though.

So did West Coast ever get any COLA? ... strange if not as things go better with Coke.