SA Footy

Everyone has been talking about the Hawks hardnuts who had a huge influence on Saturday - Hodge, Guerra, Sewell, etc..
Have the crows drafted enough hard nut midfielders of late to win a flag in the next few years..??
I think of Vince, McKay, Knights, Douglas, Jacky, Otten..
Skillful players maybe, but hardly strike fear into the opposition.

catchisthecry wrote:Everyone has been talking about the Hawks hardnuts who had a huge influence on Saturday - Hodge, Guerra, Sewell, etc..
Have the crows drafted enough hard nut midfielders of late to win a flag in the next few years..??
I think of Vince, McKay, Knights, Douglas, Jacky, Otten..
Skillful players maybe, but hardly strike fear into the opposition.

Not all of those guys were drafted to be midfielders for starters. Plus you are comparing seasoned, experienced AFL players with 1st and 2nd year players.

Thompson, VB, Reilly, Shirley, Doughty & Porplyzia are more experienced heads who can crunch the packs and I think they do a good job, all things considered. Vince is coming along in that area too.

In fact, the talk among some Crows fans is that they want less of that type of player and more of some sheer brilliance in the side.

A lot is made of Hodge being a "hard nut" (which he is) but he's also one of their most skilful players which makes him a somewhat unique (and standout) player in the AFL currently. The danger is you go looking in the draft for a "hard nut" in an attempt to find your own Luke Hodge you'll probably come up with nothing. Because unless you have the no 1 pick you won't find him.

You could add Sam Mitchell and Campbell Brown to your list.

hondo71 wrote: Because unless you have the no 1 pick you won't find him.

You could always trade aggressively to get that pick. Hawthorn traded a Victorian S/O player to Freo who was a top 3 pick himself to get that Hodge and Luke Mcpharlin ( virtually unknown at that stage I admit) also and got Sam Mitchell with a pick in the deal.

Could not believe when Dave Wildy was saying on the weekend" Look at all the No.1 picks in the Premiership side thats why Adelaide cant rebuild as fast " Bloody hell Hodge is the only one in the side.

hondo71 wrote:

catchisthecry wrote:Everyone has been talking about the Hawks hardnuts who had a huge influence on Saturday - Hodge, Guerra, Sewell, etc..
Have the crows drafted enough hard nut midfielders of late to win a flag in the next few years..??
I think of Vince, McKay, Knights, Douglas, Jacky, Otten..
Skillful players maybe, but hardly strike fear into the opposition.

Not all of those guys were drafted to be midfielders for starters. Plus you are comparing seasoned, experienced AFL players with 1st and 2nd year players.

Thompson, VB, Reilly, Shirley, Doughty & Porplyzia are more experienced heads who can crunch the packs and I think they do a good job, all things considered. Vince is coming along in that area too.

In fact, the talk among some Crows fans is that they want less of that type of player and more of some sheer brilliance in the side.

A lot is made of Hodge being a "hard nut" (which he is) but he's also one of their most skilful players which makes him a somewhat unique (and standout) player in the AFL currently. The danger is you go looking in the draft for a "hard nut" in an attempt to find your own Luke Hodge you'll probably come up with nothing. Because unless you have the no 1 pick you won't find him.

You could add Sam Mitchell and Campbell Brown to your list.

That bloke is just stupid and shows no respect for his body i love the way he goes about it.

AFL teams definitely need a few blokes like that.
Crows have none.
Shirley? VB? you're kidding aren't ya. Good honest goers, not hard nuts

catchisthecry wrote:AFL teams definitely need a few blokes like that.
Crows have none.
Shirley? VB? you're kidding aren't ya. Good honest goers, not hard nuts

Well VB is gutsy and always puts his body on the line, does that make him a hard nut? Maybe yes, maybe no.

NFC wrote:

catchisthecry wrote:AFL teams definitely need a few blokes like that.
Crows have none.
Shirley? VB? you're kidding aren't ya. Good honest goers, not hard nuts

Well VB is gutsy and always puts his body on the line, does that make him a hard nut? Maybe yes, maybe no.

No hes not a hard nut. Simple as that.

This months Alpha mag has a Harden the f**k up article and on the list is the Adelaide Crows and a fair call I would think

Simple we dont have any !!!

Tassie Blues wrote:This months Alpha mag has a Harden the f**k up article and on the list is the Adelaide Crows and a fair call I would think

nice

catchisthecry wrote:AFL teams definitely need a few blokes like that.
Crows have none.
Shirley? VB? you're kidding aren't ya. Good honest goers, not hard nuts

ya agree mate..don't believe the Crows have any hard nuts! All nice boys!

Here we have the latest footy buzz phrase. The premiership team always gets a tag-line and that becomes the new "standard" for all teams ..... until the next premiership team! 12 months ago it was all about speed and .... wait for the buzz phrase .... "attacking football".

Unfortunately the problem with these buzz phrases is that no-one can agree what they mean.

Who are the "hard nuts" at the WB, Geelong, Collingwood, Sydney. Names like Kirk, Ling, ?, ?, come to mind ... you can't tell me that VB or Scott Thompson are out of their ball-park. Would you rather have Thompson or Guerra?

I said before and will say again ... Luke Hodge is a stand-out player & much more than just a "hard nut". In fact, can someone give me a definition of a hard nut before this thread goes on any further on its Crows-bashing path?

hondo71 wrote:Would you rather have Thompson or Guerra?

Guerra.

Thompson would not get a game for Hawthorn so i have to go Guerra. Thompson is a very good player but given the role he plays there isn't a spot for him at Hawthorn. His disposal is not up to the standard required (would you want him kicking out after a point?) and quite frankly we have a lot of midfielders who are better than him.

Not sure why you chose to compare a midfielder with a back pocket/ half back flanker though

rod_rooster wrote:

hondo71 wrote:Would you rather have Thompson or Guerra?

Guerra.

Thompson would not get a game for Hawthorn so i have to go Guerra. Thompson is a very good player but given the role he plays there isn't a spot for him at Hawthorn. His disposal is not up to the standard required (would you want him kicking out after a point?) and quite frankly we have a lot of midfielders who are better than him.

Not sure why you chose to compare a midfielder with a back pocket/ half back flanker though

Im not a huge Thompson fan, but that statement is silly.

Guerra is a back pocket, and ONLY a back pocket. Thompson is more versatile, and would get a game at Hawthorn easy.

rod_rooster wrote:Guerra.

Thompson would not get a game for Hawthorn so i have to go Guerra. Thompson is a very good player but given the role he plays there isn't a spot for him at Hawthorn. His disposal is not up to the standard required (would you want him kicking out after a point?) and quite frankly we have a lot of midfielders who are better than him.

Not sure why you chose to compare a midfielder with a back pocket/ half back flanker though

I am comparing them because this new buzz-term doesn't distinguish players by position. Just on whether they are a hard nut. Guerra was the second player listed by the author of this thread, after Hodge. Apparently every team needs players like Guerra. You've proved this flaw by saying you'd take Guerra over Thompson.

On that, are you seriously telling me that if the Crows offered the Hawks Thompson for Guerra, that the Hawks wouldn't do the trade (and give up one of their now vitally important "hard-nuts"?)

Back-up players in a premiership side always look suddenly twice the player they actually are, the day after GF day (look at some of those West Coast premiership players now the stars are gone), but that's taking it to the extreme.

I agree with Hondo, in that "buzz words" emanate every year after the GF decider ... I can recall it starting back as early as the 90's when the West Coast were markedly bigger and stronger than their opponents, and back then most clubs went the route of trying to out muscle them (ie, effectively adopt a similar approach to size) when it was through the use of pace that they were able to be broken down.

What Hawthorn have, is not just 2 or 3 hard nuts, but to a man they play this "anti social"/in your face/ pressure the opposition footy, which again were buzz words for a style that has effectively existed for ages.

However, it's worth noting the success of the style, as all of the following premiers had a fair amount of this element to their style:

Collingwood 90
Hawthorn 91
West Coast 92 & 94
Carlton 95
Kangaroos 95 & 99
Essendon 2000
Brisbane 2001,02,03
Port 04
Sydney 05

Really on 2 or 3 "hard nuts" won't get the job done, it needs to be a menatality and style adopted by an entire playing group, which Clarkson has installed very well at Hawthorn.

Even at SANFL level, both Port and Central have had periods of dominance playing a similar brand ... Personally it's always been my belief that it's the only style that regularly holds up in the greatest pressure-cooker situations, when it's easier to force mistakes.

Naturally, you also need a fair amount of talent in your side to make it as far as Hawthorn have, as you still need to use the ball properly when you've forced an opponent to cough it up.

hondo71 wrote:
On that, are you seriously telling me that if the Crows offered the Hawks Thompson for Guerra, that the Hawks wouldn't do the trade (and give up one of their now vitally important "hard-nuts"?)

I really don't think Hawthorn would do that trade. Why would they? Thompson would not fit in to the Hawks side. I'm not suggesting Guerra is a better player but he plays a role that Thompson can't. Who in the Hawks midfield would Thompson replace?

rod_rooster wrote:I really don't think Hawthorn would do that trade. Why would they? Thompson would not fit in to the Hawks side. I'm not suggesting Guerra is a better player but he plays a role that Thompson can't. Who in the Hawks midfield would Thompson replace?

Keep him then ... the deal's off!

Once they fix the 'Rush-behinds' rule, Guerra will become redundant.

Felch wrote:Once they fix the 'Rush-behinds' rule, Guerra will become redundant.

Yep,it's the only thing he is good for. What do you mean by fix it ? I think you mean F*** it.