2017 Grand Final : Adelaide v Richmond

[Magellan]

Good to see you are philosophical about the game and result Benny. I'm kicking myself for not putting some coin on Richmond now, as I doubted the Crows away form (as noted in a few of my earlier posts) I didn't see the 48pt margin though. I think you need to make changes not wholesale ones but changes nonetheless. I'm just a mug punter with an opinion, but if you don't change things, good chance you get a similar result.

a similar result would suit me just fine - top of the ladder, two crushing wins against decent opposition, and a grand final appearance against a team that most people thought was inferior.

obviously it didnt work out on the day and we weren't good enough for the last game but if i can have a repeat season up until the last game im obviously taking it

Definitely. The thing is, you might not be so lucky to have the same year next year. Time will tell.

BTW, you used 'obviously' twice in one sentence - are you sure you're not an AFL player?

[bennymacca]

Look yeah nah

[Booney]

Morning all.

Great day.

[JK]

Easy to pot players like Douglas and Mackay when we get pumped but both of those lads have been excellent all year.

I wrote a post on GF eve but didn't submit, suggesting how likely it was that whilst we couldn't separate the teams by much prior to the game, more than likely there would be some decent potting of blokes once the result was known 24hrs later. From memory the examples I wrote were Mackay and Jenkins, Lambert and Houli. As it turned out 2 of them faltered but the other 2 shone.

I think the challenge for all losing GF sides, is to work out what's kneejerk and what's legitimate. The Crows had previously shown instances of being gun shy in front of goal in big games, and susceptible to intense physical pressure. Imho they were exposed on those issues again, but they weren't issues limited to 1 or 2 players.

So in a roundabout way I think you're right Benny, far more went right than wrong for the season, and the bulk of the players need to be backed in to redeem themselves. No shame in losing to a very good Richmond side, but the nature of the loss would be the concern. How they address their deficiencies when so many displayed them, won't be easy, but you'd have to think there's enough there presently to work with to get you back to the business end of another season.

Similar to Port last decade, a lot of their list copped it after dominant seasons where they fell short near the end, but they didn't throw out the baby with the bath water, and eventually prevailed.

[Booney]

The system that works so well, so often, also gets broken down so emphatically in the same fashion.

Deny them the run from half back and space to "change lanes" as they take the ball forward and the system falls apart. All of a sudden there's no space out the back to drop back into or go back into and double back up at the ball carrier ( Lynch does this the best, pushes up when Adelaide are defending, rushes forward when they get the ball and doubles back as the lead up when the traffic is all going the other way ) and then they score with ease as the opposition defence scrambles.

Richmonds forced set up ( forced by the loss of Vickery, poor form of Griffiths and lack of key forwards ) was almost the prefect structure to topple Adelaide. How did so many people, me included, get it so wrong?

Adelaide were overwhelming favorites, I backed them 60+ on Friday night at $11, by noon on Saturday that had come into $7, I wasn't the only one who saw it going that way. Having said that I'll pay up again to watch that all unfold again.

[Magellan]

Easy to pot players like Douglas and Mackay when we get pumped but both of those lads have been excellent all year.

Agree. Unfair to focus on those guys, its the whole team across the board (and in particular its leaders) who deserve to cop criticism for Saturday's poor performance, except for Matt Crouch and perhaps Sloane (in the first half).

I think Franz Beckenbauer's quote about the German side's disappointing effort in the 2006 World Cup probably applies to the Crows:

"If you took all the German players apart from Kahn, put them in a sack, and hit the sack with a baseball bat there's not one of them who wouldn't deserve it."

[Booney]

I think most of observers thought the crows this year were different to previous years. We had some good wins against good opposition in scrappy games which we haven’t had in previous years. That just wasn’t there on the weekend. Richmond’s pressure was exceptional and exposed us.

In general I can’t see us changing too much. Ball using midfielders are still what we need. Going after Gibbs again would be good.

If lever and Cameron go it won’t be the end of the world. Some top end talent from the draft or a good player or two will come our way.

Easy to pot players like Douglas and Mackay when we get pumped but both of those lads have been excellent all year.

Having said that we would want players like Milera and galluchi and this years draft picks to come through and displace those sorts of guys.

I can’t see any of our top liners dropping off too much so that holds us in good stead.

We were nowhere good enough on the day but I don’t think it’s panic stations. We will be there abouts next year.

I'd be potting the coaching staff. They were happy to let Jacobs go up on his lonesome and win tap after tap only to be hitting down to a midfield outnumbered by at least 1 and sometimes 2 Richmond mids, often one on the defensive side of the contest who was there as a backstop if Adelaide won the ball or to break forward when Richmond did. That was structural > coaches.

For the players they took the easy down the line option too often and weren't prepared to take the risk to centre the ball or play on. All of this though was forced by Richmond's pressure on the ball carrier when in play and then choking space up the field when Adelaide players were kicking over the mark.

[The Bedge]

The Jacobs ruck work was frustrating to watch, especially when he was against Griggs. Would go up uncontested and just slap it down front and centre, Richmond swoop in, read it off the hands and away they went.

Thought would've liked him to try something different - grab and kick out the ruck or maybe even just the Hail Mary punch forward try and clear the stoppage.. anything than just hitting forward to Tigers mids.

[Booney]

The Jacobs ruck work was frustrating to watch, especially when he was against Griggs. Would go up uncontested and just slap it down front and centre, Richmond swoop in, read it off the hands and away they went.

Thought would've liked him to try something different - grab and kick out the ruck or maybe even just the Hail Mary punch forward try and clear the stoppage.. anything than just hitting forward to Tigers mids.

Considering the wall Richmond had built across the middle of the ground anything to make space and get out of the press would have been better than what they kept doing.

[morell]

Some good posts ITT!

Totally agree that Adelaide got their structure all kinds of wrong. They had to even out the numbers at the contest, but refused to do it. Richmond would inevitably win their fair share and more (despite Jacobs dominating) and then scrag it up forward, tap it, hit it, toe it, spoil it, whatever to make it a "bubbling" ball in their forward line which of course advantaged their small types perfectly. Melbourne play a very similar way - reminded me a lot of how they beat Port during the year.

Had Adelaide pushed say ... Laird or Brown into the midfield to even it out and sacrificed their numbers behind the ball a bit, dare I say it with Jacobs winning they would've got on top of the clearances and provided messrs Walker, Betts and Jenkins more opportunity.

But Pyke backed his system in, as he had done all year. It just happened to backfire as Booney said, Richmond play almost the perfect style to foil them. Easy in hindsight.

[mighty hounds]

I think most of observers thought the crows this year were different to previous years. We had some good wins against good opposition in scrappy games which we haven’t had in previous years. That just wasn’t there on the weekend. Richmond’s pressure was exceptional and exposed us.

In general I can’t see us changing too much. Ball using midfielders are still what we need. Going after Gibbs again would be good.

If lever and Cameron go it won’t be the end of the world. Some top end talent from the draft or a good player or two will come our way.

Easy to pot players like Douglas and Mackay when we get pumped but both of those lads have been excellent all year.

Having said that we would want players like Milera and galluchi and this years draft picks to come through and displace those sorts of guys.

I can’t see any of our top liners dropping off too much so that holds us in good stead.

We were nowhere good enough on the day but I don’t think it’s panic stations. We will be there abouts next year.

I'd be potting the coaching staff. They were happy to let Jacobs go up on his lonesome and win tap after tap only to be hitting down to a midfield outnumbered by at least 1 and sometimes 2 Richmond mids, often one on the defensive side of the contest who was there as a backstop if Adelaide won the ball or to break forward when Richmond did. That was structural > coaches.

For the players they took the easy down the line option too often and weren't prepared to take the risk to centre the ball or play on. All of this though was forced by Richmond's pressure on the ball carrier when in play and then choking space up the field when Adelaide players were kicking over the mark.

This is exactly what Geelong would do against us until we knocked them off in Adelaide round 18? We counted by switching the ball and opening up the outer side of the ground. Watching the game live we had so many opportunities to switch the ball but just bombed into Richmonds hands. Couldn't believe the amount of times we passed it up, they looked to nervous to do it. ah well hopefully they live and they learn

[Wedgie]

Buger the game, just watched a replay of the Killers performance!
They've set the bar as far as bands on the big stage go, a slight contrast to the last one I saw, Meatloaf!

A pity they're not coming to Adelaide, still spewing I missed them play at Thebby Theatre many years ago.
Before the GF my missus had never heard of them!
Musn'thave been big in Northern England!

[morell]

Buger the game, just watched a replay of the Killers performance!
They've set the bar as far as bands on the big stage go, a slight contrast to the last one I saw, Meatloaf!

A pity they're not coming to Adelaide, still spewing I missed them play at Thebby Theatre many years ago.
Before the GF my missus had never heard of them!
Musn'thave been big in Northern England!

I've watched the replay a stack of times too. They were seriously good. I didn't realise I like them so much, they have quite a few absolute belters.

If they're ever in Adelaide I'll be front and centre.

[Jim05]

Buger the game, just watched a replay of the Killers performance!
They've set the bar as far as bands on the big stage go, a slight contrast to the last one I saw, Meatloaf!

A pity they're not coming to Adelaide, still spewing I missed them play at Thebby Theatre many years ago.
Before the GF my missus had never heard of them!
Musn'thave been big in Northern England!

I've watched the replay a stack of times too. They were seriously good. I didn't realise I like them so much, they have quite a few absolute belters.

If they're ever in Adelaide I'll be front and centre.

Didn't see them before the game but they were awesome at the aftermatch concert

[Booney]

I reckon the loss of Smith and McGovern isn't getting the recognition it deserves, little does it matter now anyway.

Seedsman played his (one and only) good game for Adelaide in the prelim replacing Smith and was found wanting on the big stage. Otten filled gaps in the first few weeks of the year but looked way out of his depth on the big occasion and had no impact at all.

The two injuries in the fortnight before the Grand final clearly dented Adelaide's chances and the talk of "one in - one out" of the "system" is crap. The system/machine only works when all the pieces are there, without key parts of the machine it breaks down.

[JK]

I reckon the loss of Smith and McGovern isn't getting the recognition it deserves, little does it matter now anyway.

Agree %100 with this

[Booney]

Anyone else still just dropping "Yellow and black" into their thoughts throughout the day?

[Lightning McQueen]

I reckon the loss of Smith and McGovern isn't getting the recognition it deserves, little does it matter now anyway.

Agree %100 with this

Yep, having Otten on the field is equivalent to playing one short.

[The Bedge]

In hindsight, would the Cows have been better off with Milera over Otten?

I thought from the start he was better suited to Richmond than another tall in Otten.

[Booney]

The thing Adelaide talked up all year "total team defence" and "total team effort" couldn't have been further from the truth on the weekend.

Sloane had a crack early, M.Crouch got his 37 touches going 35m and Laird had some bright moments, bar that the rest of them can hang their heads. Nobody played 4 quarters.

( If anyone mentions Jacobs then don't be silly, I could have had 40 hit outs with no opponent )