State of the game

Talk on the national game

Re: State of the game

Postby Splinter » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:03 pm

Lots of talk on watching games on TV now versus the 90's and the drop in standard.
One thing to consider is that fact we are 'blessed' with Foxtel and have access to view all 9 games over the course of the weekend.
Compare this to the 90's where we may have watched the Friday night game (with teams fixtured deserving of this slot) and the game of the day from Saturday and Sunday. The broadcaster would show the SA teams game, which supporters watch regardless of the quality, and then the best game of the round, so we were seeing a higher standard. We were not subjected to a Brisbane v Fitzroy game for example in the early 90's when both teams struggled but now have access to the Suns and Carlton games each week.

Stop changing the rules and accept with your expanded competition that some teams will be weaker and when these teams play off the standard will be down.
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Re: State of the game

Postby bennymacca » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:10 pm

Very good point about greater exposure to all the games
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Re: State of the game

Postby PatowalongaPirate » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:13 pm

bennymacca wrote:
PatowalongaPirate wrote:I don't recall too many Finals matches I've turned off due to being a poor standard, and Finals are the reason this game is played. I am not sold on bringing in changes that are going to affect the way the post season is played.


It’s easy to tolerate a poor standard finals game though because there is something huge on the end of it which holds your interest

So crappy game becomes “good contested footy”

(Also helps that finals are between the best teams so the skill level is usually much higher)

Which is why I am not convinced bringing in zones etc will be good for the game. I couldn't care if round 12 between the Suns and Saints was a dour struggle when it comes to watching Football in the Spring.
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Re: State of the game

Postby PatowalongaPirate » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:15 pm

Splinter wrote:Lots of talk on watching games on TV now versus the 90's and the drop in standard.
One thing to consider is that fact we are 'blessed' with Foxtel and have access to view all 9 games over the course of the weekend.
Compare this to the 90's where we may have watched the Friday night game (with teams fixtured deserving of this slot) and the game of the day from Saturday and Sunday. The broadcaster would show the SA teams game, which supporters watch regardless of the quality, and then the best game of the round, so we were seeing a higher standard. We were not subjected to a Brisbane v Fitzroy game for example in the early 90's when both teams struggled but now have access to the Suns and Carlton games each week.

Stop changing the rules and accept with your expanded competition that some teams will be weaker and when these teams play off the standard will be down.


A lot of people choose to ignore this when championing their own agendas.
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Re: State of the game

Postby Senor Moto Gadili » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:19 pm

FlyingHigh wrote:
tigerpie wrote:Selwood and others saying shorten the game?
He's punchy as f@#k! Struggle with coherent sentences at times tonight.
Shorten the game and shorten your pay packet pal.

The game evolves, always has. Lessen the rotations has merit.


We need to go back pre-95 and extend the quarters to 25 minutes without timeon for out of bounds and ballups.
More examples of the current ridiculous method in the Port-Freo game - first quarter went 29:40 minutes for 3 goals, second quarter 28:20 for zero goals (correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think was a stretcher in these quarters?) That's 18 minutes of time-on for three goals, and only 13 scoring shots in total.

Shortening the game will do nothing to eliminate congestion. In fact, it might cause even more congestion because players are less fatigued. I'm an advocate for shortening the game to 15 minutes with time on, but it isn't the answer to congestion. I'm prepared to keep an open mind on zones, but the devil is in the detail and I'm not sure you can assess the success of zones based on what has happened in U18 games. I'm sure they will move to 4 umpires, which means they could abolish the ruck nomination and have an umpire close to play who could throw it quickly. That would help.
The best way to eliminate congestion is for teams to improve their goal kicking efficiency. Some of the best (high scoring) games this year, like Swans v North last Sunday all involved accurate goal kicking. So, let's widen the goals by 2 metres!
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Re: State of the game

Postby FlyingHigh » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:17 pm

Senor Moto Gadili wrote:
FlyingHigh wrote:
tigerpie wrote:Selwood and others saying shorten the game?
He's punchy as f@#k! Struggle with coherent sentences at times tonight.
Shorten the game and shorten your pay packet pal.

The game evolves, always has. Lessen the rotations has merit.


We need to go back pre-95 and extend the quarters to 25 minutes without timeon for out of bounds and ballups.
More examples of the current ridiculous method in the Port-Freo game - first quarter went 29:40 minutes for 3 goals, second quarter 28:20 for zero goals (correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think was a stretcher in these quarters?) That's 18 minutes of time-on for three goals, and only 13 scoring shots in total.

Shortening the game will do nothing to eliminate congestion. In fact, it might cause even more congestion because players are less fatigued. I'm an advocate for shortening the game to 15 minutes with time on, but it isn't the answer to congestion. I'm prepared to keep an open mind on zones, but the devil is in the detail and I'm not sure you can assess the success of zones based on what has happened in U18 games. I'm sure they will move to 4 umpires, which means they could abolish the ruck nomination and have an umpire close to play who could throw it quickly. That would help.
The best way to eliminate congestion is for teams to improve their goal kicking efficiency. Some of the best (high scoring) games this year, like Swans v North last Sunday all involved accurate goal kicking. So, let's widen the goals by 2 metres!


I was thinking of it more in terms of when players complain about how hard the game is on their bodies, and the games with the most ball-ups and therefore tackles and scrimmages, go for inordinately longer than more open games. It is conceivable that it wouldn't decrease congestion and I hadn't and wasn't thinking of it from this angle, but then if there is just as much congestion, it just won't go for as long.
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Re: State of the game

Postby Senor Moto Gadili » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:34 pm

Goal scoring adds more time on than stoppages.

North Melbourne v Sydney
Q1 28:44
Q2 31:03
Q3 31:20
Q4 31:29

Fremantle v Power
Q1 29:42
Q2 28:23
Q3 33:26 (Robbie Gray stretcher)
Q4 29:50
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Re: State of the game

Postby daysofourlives » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:35 pm

Ive said it before the only time the game is unpredictable is at a centre bounce and for the ensuing lets sy 30 seconds to a minute. We need to replicate that for a majority of the game. Once that minute passes all clubs are able to set up defensively and it becomes a boring mess of 36 players around the football. Im all for whatever it takes. Buckleys argument that we will be waiting for players to get back in zones is flawed. How bout as a coach you leave your players in the zone, if you dont want to do that then you force the hand of the rule makers to make a zone that certain players cant leave and we dont want that. The coaches should shut their mouths, they are the reson we are in this predicament. Too many coaches in the game, restricting that would help. Ive been taking notice of assistant coaches when they speak after games on radio etc and all they talk about is defence, when they lose its all about letting the opposition score too freely, its a mindset and a blighht on the game.
I used to think reducing rotations would help but given the mindset of coaches i dont think it will. They will just instruct the players to play keepings off and kick backwards and maintain possesion.
Im all for shorter games but only if they extgend the season to 34 matches. Shofrter games equal play more often, you might play on a Monday and then a FRiday and back up the next Wednesday like a basketball draw, still fit the season in, inthe same time frame. Less training more playing, im sure the players would love it. Have your bigger drawing games on weekends and your suns v carlton type game on a tuesday night. Maximiose your crowds on a weekend and who cares if theres 5 people at a game during the week. I know the idea is out there but it could work

Wubbsy i understand a Sydney fan you have a very different interpretation of whats exciting football. To 90% of fans the Sydney way is what has got us into this mess. If it wasnt for Geelong and Hawthorn over the last 10 years we wouldve reached this point long ago.
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Re: State of the game

Postby Gilligan » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:39 pm

woodublieve12 wrote:
helicopterking wrote:
woodublieve12 wrote:zero issue with the state of the game.... Sick of everytime their is a bad game the media kick up a stink... Every professional sport has bad games, they dont instantly look for changes...


Of course you don’t mind congestion. Sydney and Paul Roos were the ones who set the standard for it and Now Longmire. Any rules resulting in less congestion or even the last touch out of bounds rule would destroy Sydney and there style of play.


it's not under 8's. worst rule in football.. Anyone who legitimately likes this rule, obviously hates football and prefers netball or soccer and is part of the problem not the solution

the last touch out of bounds rule is ridiculous , after early year attending an SANFL game where this rule is used and watching 3 players shephard the ball for 25 metres as it rolled out as they knew they were going to get the free kick . Goes against everything was taught and belived as a junior about going and getting the ball . As a consequence of watching this I have gone from attending SANFL games weekly to not going as it is no longer footy , can see if bought into AFL might as well give up and start watching the divers game soccer
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Re: State of the game

Postby woodublieve12 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:40 pm

What mess Days? Thinning of the talent pool has done that. Two teams too many. Simples.

As I’ve said, I’d rather play boring footy and play finals and be around the mark than sides who play exciting footy and are up and down...

Look at the sides who have won the flags the last 10-15 years majority of them are the best defensive sides in the comp
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Re: State of the game

Postby tigerpie » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:57 pm

Having 1or 2 players from each team in the 50 at all times may work, restrict interchange further as well.
Do not touch time game time, that's not fair on the fans.
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Re: State of the game

Postby Brodlach » Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:22 pm

FFS Martin is a protected player


This continues it will be off in 2 minutes
July 11th 2012....
Brodlach wrote:Rory Laird might end up the best IMO, he is an absolute jet. He has been in great form at the Bloods
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Re: State of the game

Postby Brodlach » Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:24 pm

Wow Grimes :lol:
July 11th 2012....
Brodlach wrote:Rory Laird might end up the best IMO, he is an absolute jet. He has been in great form at the Bloods
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Re: State of the game

Postby cracka » Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:39 pm

daysofourlives wrote:Ive said it before the only time the game is unpredictable is at a centre bounce and for the ensuing lets sy 30 seconds to a minute. We need to replicate that for a majority of the game. Once that minute passes all clubs are able to set up defensively and it becomes a boring mess of 36 players around the football. Im all for whatever it takes. Buckleys argument that we will be waiting for players to get back in zones is flawed. How bout as a coach you leave your players in the zone, if you dont want to do that then you force the hand of the rule makers to make a zone that certain players cant leave and we dont want that. The coaches should shut their mouths, they are the reson we are in this predicament. Too many coaches in the game, restricting that would help. Ive been taking notice of assistant coaches when they speak after games on radio etc and all they talk about is defence, when they lose its all about letting the opposition score too freely, its a mindset and a blighht on the game.
I used to think reducing rotations would help but given the mindset of coaches i dont think it will. They will just instruct the players to play keepings off and kick backwards and maintain possesion.
Im all for shorter games but only if they extgend the season to 34 matches. Shofrter games equal play more often, you might play on a Monday and then a FRiday and back up the next Wednesday like a basketball draw, still fit the season in, inthe same time frame. Less training more playing, im sure the players would love it. Have your bigger drawing games on weekends and your suns v carlton type game on a tuesday night. Maximiose your crowds on a weekend and who cares if theres 5 people at a game during the week. I know the idea is out there but it could work

Wubbsy i understand a Sydney fan you have a very different interpretation of whats exciting football. To 90% of fans the Sydney way is what has got us into this mess. If it wasnt for Geelong and Hawthorn over the last 10 years we wouldve reached this point long ago.

Wow. Well said. Don't mind the 34 match season idea either.
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Re: State of the game

Postby woodublieve12 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:14 pm

cracka wrote:
daysofourlives wrote:Ive said it before the only time the game is unpredictable is at a centre bounce and for the ensuing lets sy 30 seconds to a minute. We need to replicate that for a majority of the game. Once that minute passes all clubs are able to set up defensively and it becomes a boring mess of 36 players around the football. Im all for whatever it takes. Buckleys argument that we will be waiting for players to get back in zones is flawed. How bout as a coach you leave your players in the zone, if you dont want to do that then you force the hand of the rule makers to make a zone that certain players cant leave and we dont want that. The coaches should shut their mouths, they are the reson we are in this predicament. Too many coaches in the game, restricting that would help. Ive been taking notice of assistant coaches when they speak after games on radio etc and all they talk about is defence, when they lose its all about letting the opposition score too freely, its a mindset and a blighht on the game.
I used to think reducing rotations would help but given the mindset of coaches i dont think it will. They will just instruct the players to play keepings off and kick backwards and maintain possesion.
Im all for shorter games but only if they extgend the season to 34 matches. Shofrter games equal play more often, you might play on a Monday and then a FRiday and back up the next Wednesday like a basketball draw, still fit the season in, inthe same time frame. Less training more playing, im sure the players would love it. Have your bigger drawing games on weekends and your suns v carlton type game on a tuesday night. Maximiose your crowds on a weekend and who cares if theres 5 people at a game during the week. I know the idea is out there but it could work

Wubbsy i understand a Sydney fan you have a very different interpretation of whats exciting football. To 90% of fans the Sydney way is what has got us into this mess. If it wasnt for Geelong and Hawthorn over the last 10 years we wouldve reached this point long ago.

Wow. Well said. Don't mind the 34 match season idea either.

Why don’t we just play all year round :roll:
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Re: State of the game

Postby daysofourlives » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:22 pm

woodublieve12 wrote:
cracka wrote:
daysofourlives wrote:Ive said it before the only time the game is unpredictable is at a centre bounce and for the ensuing lets sy 30 seconds to a minute. We need to replicate that for a majority of the game. Once that minute passes all clubs are able to set up defensively and it becomes a boring mess of 36 players around the football. Im all for whatever it takes. Buckleys argument that we will be waiting for players to get back in zones is flawed. How bout as a coach you leave your players in the zone, if you dont want to do that then you force the hand of the rule makers to make a zone that certain players cant leave and we dont want that. The coaches should shut their mouths, they are the reson we are in this predicament. Too many coaches in the game, restricting that would help. Ive been taking notice of assistant coaches when they speak after games on radio etc and all they talk about is defence, when they lose its all about letting the opposition score too freely, its a mindset and a blighht on the game.
I used to think reducing rotations would help but given the mindset of coaches i dont think it will. They will just instruct the players to play keepings off and kick backwards and maintain possesion.
Im all for shorter games but only if they extgend the season to 34 matches. Shofrter games equal play more often, you might play on a Monday and then a FRiday and back up the next Wednesday like a basketball draw, still fit the season in, inthe same time frame. Less training more playing, im sure the players would love it. Have your bigger drawing games on weekends and your suns v carlton type game on a tuesday night. Maximiose your crowds on a weekend and who cares if theres 5 people at a game during the week. I know the idea is out there but it could work

Wubbsy i understand a Sydney fan you have a very different interpretation of whats exciting football. To 90% of fans the Sydney way is what has got us into this mess. If it wasnt for Geelong and Hawthorn over the last 10 years we wouldve reached this point long ago.

Wow. Well said. Don't mind the 34 match season idea either.

Why don’t we just play all year round :roll:


Comprehension not a strong point for you Wubbsy, i said play the 34 games in the same time frame we do now. Im not surprised, you only see the Swans, the rest of us see whats best for the game and the damage the Swans have done to the brand over the last 15 years. I perfer the type of damage you did to the brand in the early 90s :D
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Re: State of the game

Postby westozfalcon » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:00 pm

gadj1976 wrote:
westozfalcon wrote:I’d like to see a rule wherein a team must have at least 1 player within its attacking 50-metre arc at ALL times. There would be a linesman at each end to monitor it. If a team breaches the rule, a flag goes up and the other side gets a penalty shot on goal from the top of the goal square.


How the Fxxx would this fix anything?

We'd have more off side type reviews than soccer does.

Stop the rule changes because the coaches will work out ways to work it to their advantage. Time for drastic change.


It would mean there is always someone to kick to in the forward line so sides don't have to hold up the ball and wait for players to run forward.
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Re: State of the game

Postby bennymacca » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:03 pm

Two divisions of 9, 24 games total, twice for teams in your own division, once for the other division, top two go up and down.

Means we get more games between the best teams, whilst still allowing all teams to play each other

There effectively is two divisions as it is with the “big” clubs getting all the best timeslots etc so it won’t change much in terms of scheduling
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Re: State of the game

Postby gadj1976 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:21 pm

Splinter wrote:Lots of talk on watching games on TV now versus the 90's and the drop in standard.
One thing to consider is that fact we are 'blessed' with Foxtel and have access to view all 9 games over the course of the weekend.
Compare this to the 90's where we may have watched the Friday night game (with teams fixtured deserving of this slot) and the game of the day from Saturday and Sunday. The broadcaster would show the SA teams game, which supporters watch regardless of the quality, and then the best game of the round, so we were seeing a higher standard. We were not subjected to a Brisbane v Fitzroy game for example in the early 90's when both teams struggled but now have access to the Suns and Carlton games each week.

Stop changing the rules and accept with your expanded competition that some teams will be weaker and when these teams play off the standard will be down.


I agree Splinter. The games we remember from the 90's are the ones we'll remember from the 2010's. Those that were horrible, we forget easily, which makes the good ones even more memorable.
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Re: State of the game

Postby gadj1976 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:24 pm

woodublieve12 wrote:
bennymacca wrote:
Jim05 wrote:
woodublieve12 wrote:zero issue with the state of the game.... Sick of everytime their is a bad game the media kick up a stink... Every professional sport has bad games, they dont instantly look for changes...

Far more bad games than good games these days. I struggle to watch more than 1 quarter of most now and there are certain teams that I generally avoid watching if possible


I have the tv on for most games on a weekend and the Sydney North was the only non crows game that really held my interest on the weekend.

I’m not a fan of the zones but I am of the opinion they need to do something, so if people smarter than me think zones are a good idea then let’s try it


zones/presses are excellent... Love watching them live


See, that's called "perspective" cos I hate watching the Swans games (generally speaking) because of exactly that. I say 'generally' because I think last week's game against the Roos was one of the best I've seen for a LONG time.
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