peter dammarrell v a certain punter

[bayman]

well we all have seen it all last night for those that were there, we last week (i wasn't there but got the story last night) 'the bad SAMmaritan' had his friend go up to have a grand on bogus cash @ $1.90 & pd saw him coming & changed it to $1.70 (my opinion is that it is his pro ogative to change) & then 'the bad SAMmaritan' had a heated discussion with pd.....fast forward to last night & as we came to the trot 'the bad SAMmaritan' went up & had $1.00 e/w @ $1.65 on four carat & kept having the same bet over & over again just to p155 off pd it was something like 300 (at least) bets on the same horse & using $50.00 & $20.00 notes when having the bet to ruin his change

i personally cant see why you'd be so childish & to vent your anger 7 days later, because to me ok fine he had his go last week but surely that should have been the end of it, not some childish prank a week later

now i happened to be in the office trying to get a monday book when pd walked in & i overheard him tell those in the office what happened & he further stated that this (last night) would probably be his last night as he wont put up with crap like that & will let them know by letter in the next few days

now we all love to put the boots into the bookies but in this case i put the boots into 'the bad SAMmaritan' as it was so childish & for pd to calmly sit there & take was astonishing because after 2 or 3 bets i would have denied him the service or closed the book

peter dammarrell the winner
the bad SAMaritan' the LOSER

globe derby without a bookie now is very likely from what i heard & i dont blame him one bit

[ralph]

your on the mark but im querying the 300 bets i think it was 50 or so but same result.

Extremely childish and a pain in the arse for all involved including those who wanted to back a different horse in the trot with the bookie (saved me money luckily)

i think the win for PD will be lessened if he takes his bat and ball and stays home because of this incident. why stoop to his level.

heres an idea why dont one of the morons from the club who are always shaking hands and spruiking what a good job theyve done to stockpile a heap of money from the poker machines by not spending any sort this problem out. It doesnt matter what you think of the service offered (even if you think he bets too much percentage, you dont have to bet with him) the service being there is better than not being there. The club doesnt realise people go there because there is a bookmaker not for the fantastic 40 year old carpet that hasnt been washed in 5 years, the 5 year old tvs with shocking pictures, the grandstand that you cant sit in because its covered in caked on dirt, or that fantastic service you get from the takeaway food isle.

Without the bookmaker why would anyone drive past one of the 300 better equiped pub tabs in adelaide and or leave home.

[bayman]

ralph, i'll stand corrected with how many bets went on but i'm sure it would have been more than 50 but that doesn't matter, it as you said is the principle of the whole thing & your right apart from a bit of socialising you may as well stay home or go to the pub, i usually bet on the tote but i go there because the tote cant make a mistake but the bookie can

[ralph]

i usually bet on the tote but i go there because the tote cant make a mistake but the bookie can

The idiots betting on the tote can make a mistake though.

Like the first wnr big price.

[bayman]

i usually bet on the tote but i go there because the tote cant make a mistake but the bookie can

The idiots betting on the tote can make a mistake though.

Like the first wnr big price.

i knew it should have been shorter when mal backed it

[centreman]

your on the mark but im querying the 300 bets i think it was 50 or so but same result.

Extremely childish and a pain in the arse for all involved including those who wanted to back a different horse in the trot with the bookie (saved me money luckily)

i think the win for PD will be lessened if he takes his bat and ball and stays home because of this incident. why stoop to his level.

heres an idea why dont one of the morons from the club who are always shaking hands and spruiking what a good job theyve done to stockpile a heap of money from the poker machines by not spending any sort this problem out. It doesnt matter what you think of the service offered (even if you think he bets too much percentage, you dont have to bet with him) the service being there is better than not being there. The club doesnt realise people go there because there is a bookmaker not for the fantastic 40 year old carpet that hasnt been washed in 5 years, the 5 year old tvs with shocking pictures, the grandstand that you cant sit in because its covered in caked on dirt, or that fantastic service you get from the takeaway food isle.

Without the bookmaker why would anyone drive past one of the 300 better equiped pub tabs in adelaide and or leave home.

Your spot on ralph!!!
I've been to some victorian trot meetings with no bookie, they end up with particpants only there. No Punters!!!!
Must be easy to make money then seeing some of the blokes who have run the pokies at GDP (wouldn't know if arse was on fire!!) and the fact only new machines they have got since day one is a second hand to replace one which blows up!!!!!

[another grub]

Can see tour point fellas..... but do we need this type of bookie at our tracks.... I have had a priced changed while I was in the line-up (because he knew what I was going to back ,,he wound it in..) and he wouldnt give me the price.....

this is an odds on fav, shouldnt you want punters coming up and putting 1k on it.....???? Poor effort PD and SAM I know how you feel....PD is a coward... that is not how you run a SERVICE !!!! he may as well be at the auditorium doing no business with the other dickheads there!!!!!!

[mal]

The fued between the SAMaritan and Peter DAMmerell has been ongoing for years.
Both are well aquainted to me and I get on very well with both of them.
Being the lone Bookie at the trots is very lonely, there is no where to hide if a
well orchestrated betting plonk filters through.
We must also consider that this is Dammerells livelyhood being a Bookie.

THE INCIDENTS

Previous week a friend of the SAMaritan approached Dammerell to put on a bet for him.
He had over or about $1,000 to put on Bogus Cash at $1-90.
As he got close to the stand Dammerell shortened the odds to 1-80 or $1-70.
I can understand why the SAMaritan would be upset that he missed the price.[we all would]
The consensus at GDP last night was that its wrong for a Bookie to do this.
I understand the SAMaritans frustration [its happened before ?]
But I also see Dammerells logic in this matter.
He is taking on the biggest and one of the most astute punters at the trots.
Over the years the SAMaritan has been a very hard punter to beat.
If you lay SAMiritan a bet of 1800/2000 that wins you are in trouble as he
may only hold about an extra $500 on the race.
When the horse shortened SAMaritan went up to Dammerell and had a heated
discussion with him for for several minutes.

If it ended there it was a stalemate between the two[apart from the loudish discussion]

SAT NIGHT
The SAMaritan as reported by BAYMAN put what appeared to be about 50 -60 bets
of $1 Each way on the favourite and subsequent winner Four Carat at odds of $1-65
to $2-05 Each Way in the last race.
It was comical to most, I thought it was amusing at the time but it dragged on far too long.
I think Dammerell took it extremely well and played out the situation very professionally.

Thats the incidents and I have to favour Dammerell overall on points.
The aftermath appears the loss of the last Bookie at GDP.

FUTURE
No bookie = loss of attendance
One of the biggest punters who goes to GDP has stated he will not go back to GDP
He uses Damerells odds as a terrific guide for his bets, without a bookie there he
has said theres no point going to GDP at all.
The punter lives in the deep southern suburbs and drives over an hour to get on course.
BAYMAN says theres no point going without a bookie there.
I also see little point in being there.
Thats 3 of us, how many more ?

ALTERNATIVES

The club should be innovative and set up a bookmaking operation of thier own.
The club would only need to break even after expenses for it to be worthwhile.
The club can win of the TAB turnover commissions which is about 10-12% of turnover.

If Dammerell quits I believe other bookies will be asked to set up operations.
On the strength of falling attendances what bookie would bother rolling up.

[bayman]

if pd does leave & they get another bookie PLEASE PLEASE be r.w. symonds

[Dutchy]

I cant see what Dammerel did wrong with all this? he has a right to reel in his prices surely?

the other bloke sounds like a tool of the highest order...

One question....do you blokes give this feedback to the Harness officials or just complain on here?

[mal]

DUTCHY
The bad SAMaritan is not a tool
All the guys on this forum would prob find him to be a nice bloke
I always have a chat with him, and sit at his table and socialise at times.
He also sponsors races at the trots.
He is a frustrated BIG punter
Lots of big punters everywhere get pissed off when bookies dont take
their large bets and cut them back.

It would be like me wanting $100 on a sports bet at $1-90 and the bookie
only allows me to have $50 at $1-90 and the rest at $1-70
I would get pissed off, but because I am only a modest punter it never happens to me.

The prob is the draconian limits set by the board in to relation to bookies risks
At the moment a bookie must accept odds to $2000 per bet ?
It used to be $1200 upped to $2000 ?
$2000 is fine if a bookie is holding $2000-$5000 per race, or has other bookies to lay off with.
When you get 1 bookie on course those $2000 limits are too lopsided
Some races I venture to say they would only hold a few bets equalling a few hundred dollars.

If the limit was $1000 I would say the lone bookies on course would not
hasten to drop the odds on runners when big punters approach them.

Bookies dropping odds has always happened, only in the past you could go
to the other bookies, when theres one bookie that creates a problem as we had last night.

[G]

I think you know the answer to your question Dutchy.
The 2 blokes complaining the most wouldnt know where to find an official let alone have the 'goolies' to complain.

[Dutchy]

Im just going on what Ive read Mal, but take your point....its a serious question, officials cant do anything without hearing the feedback

why wouldnt Dammeral have a laptop dialled into BF and lay off on there like many other bookies do?

[mal]

Im just going on what Ive read Mal, but take your point....its a serious question, officials cant do anything without hearing the ****

why wouldnt Dammeral have a laptop dialled into BF and lay off on there like many other bookies do?

What can officials do ?
Any person intoxicated or using foul language can be escorted off the racecourse.

Can a bookie bet on Betfair to lay off ?
Dont think there allowed to.
They can ring up and lay off with other bookies
However in this day and age you prob. would not find a bookie to lay off with at all by phone.

Punters mobile phones
Theres a ruling [superceded ?] that disallows you from having a mobile phone on
course for the purpose of betting with an off course betting agency if your a punter

The above are in place, but from what I have seen are not policed properly

[Dutchy]

Im talking about the officials getting a bookie to field etc, creating incentives to get more than one etc etc

trust me Mal the biggest Bookies in the country all lay off their positions on Betfair

[mighty_tiger_79]

if you are a registered participant in the industry you are not allowed to use betfair.

[Dutchy]

if you are a registered participant in the industry you are not allowed to use betfair.

how are they going to police that?...again trust me it happens

[Joey]

Dutchy,
Trust me PD has considered the Betfair option but it is currently not legal in South Australia for a bookmaker to access Betfair on-course. And bookies operations are monitored closely enough to make it not an option to attempt to do it illegally. Mal is on the right track (as always) the limits are the crux of this situation. Plus the punter in question is too big for a one bookie ring.

[Dutchy]

OK so not legal in SA, I know of a NT operation that do it nearly every race to balance the books....what if PD registered under his wife's name?

[mighty_tiger_79]

if you are a registered participant in the industry you are not allowed to use betfair.

how are they going to police that?...again trust me it happens

DUTCHY

i realise that it happens, im just saying the rules are that licenced/registered persons arent allowed to use betfair, but i know it happens, and i know people who are registered that use it.

it would be interesting to see what the penalty involved is if people get caught