SA Footy

Hang on,didn't a little club called Echunga win a flag 2014
Population 1000 , how many flags have Blackwood won since joining?
When was Mt Barker's last flag?
Apart from last year when was Hahndorf's last flag?
Remember they finished bottom or near bottom in A's&B's in 2014
Uriadla have dominated the last decade and they are not a big club

running defender wrote:Hang on,didn't a little club called Echunga win a flag 2014
Population 1000 , how many flags have Blackwood won since joining?
When was Mt Barker's last flag?
Apart from last year when was Hahndorf's last flag?
Remember they finished bottom or near bottom in A's&B's in 2014
Uriadla have dominated the last decade and they are not a big club

Good call RD, Why isnt it that Nairne is not classified as a big town club? Their population must be close if not more than Hahndorf, certainly more than Echunga and Uraidla (probably combined!) What about the population of Lobethal? and Onkas would have to be up there as well with their 3 x towns.

Not sure I would say that smaller town clubs are there just to make up the numbers. Big clubs can lose identity and the community feel, making smaller clubs more appealing. Like everything it will ebb and flow. With only 2 x games so far, who knows how things will pan out for the rest of the season. Im sure clubs in the RMFL could have the same argument, so too in the Barossa, Gawler and Light, etc..

At what cost? Look at Echunga now, Mt Lofty are still paying off their debt and Uraidla have been propped up by Parker money but their juniors have been floundering for years. The model of all three isn't sustainable for Div 1. Then add in Torrens Valley who have been elevated by the money of Hughes still without success in Div 1. The state of their juniors is terribly low. Onkas and Ironbank are doing okay just to keep their heads above water but the reality is premiership success won't be coming anytime soon. Lobethal have put up a good fight in recent years but get tested by depth and usually fail as the season goes on. So that leaves the three clubs who are flushed with numbers, sponsors and money. This situation isnt going to change for a while. Happy to be proven wrong when the end of season comes but I think it's time some of the Div 1 smaller clubs consider where they actually fit in the HFL. I think Bridgewater have found some solace and happiness in Div 2.

^ spot on Rock.... A 4 team comp in Div 1 really would be the ducks nuts!

rock wrote:At what cost? Look at Echunga now, Mt Lofty are still paying off their debt and Uraidla have been propped up by Parker money but their juniors have been floundering for years. The model of all three isn't sustainable for Div 1. Then add in Torrens Valley who have been elevated by the money of Hughes still without success in Div 1. The state of their juniors is terribly low. Onkas and Ironbank are doing okay just to keep their heads above water but the reality is premiership success won't be coming anytime soon. Lobethal have put up a good fight in recent years but get tested by depth and usually fail as the season goes on. So that leaves the three clubs who are flushed with numbers, sponsors and money. This situation isnt going to change for a while. Happy to be proven wrong when the end of season comes but I think it's time some of the Div 1 smaller clubs consider where they actually fit in the HFL. I think Bridgewater have found some solace and happiness in Div 2.

Unsure what you mean at what cost? Look at Echunga now??

Prelim Final Last year
Last week only lost by a few points to last year's grand finalist
and all junior grades have a win in central division......

sounds like a positive step in the right direction to me

rock wrote:At what cost? Look at Echunga now, Mt Lofty are still paying off their debt and Uraidla have been propped up by Parker money but their juniors have been floundering for years. The model of all three isn't sustainable for Div 1. Then add in Torrens Valley who have been elevated by the money of Hughes still without success in Div 1. The state of their juniors is terribly low. Onkas and Ironbank are doing okay just to keep their heads above water but the reality is premiership success won't be coming anytime soon. Lobethal have put up a good fight in recent years but get tested by depth and usually fail as the season goes on. So that leaves the three clubs who are flushed with numbers, sponsors and money. This situation isnt going to change for a while. Happy to be proven wrong when the end of season comes but I think it's time some of the Div 1 smaller clubs consider where they actually fit in the HFL. I think Bridgewater have found some solace and happiness in Div 2.

Ok throwing an idea out here.
3 divisions of 6 clubs ( let you people decide the club's for each div )
all Div 1 have to field the 5 grades or if they forfeit say 2 games over all the grade's they can be relegated to div 2 the following season if the Div 2 premier can field all 5.
Div 2 to field 5 hopefully or at least 4 grades, ( again let you people decide ) but if a club wants to go up to Div 1 it must field 5 in Div 1
Div 3 to field whatever grades they can but can be helped out by bigger clubs perhaps giving them extra colts to field a team.
Each club 5x3 = 15 rounds with the wildcard being the top 3 Div 1 clubs play the top 3 Div 2 clubs and the 3 bottom Div 1 play the 3 bottom Div 2 with results counting against them on their premiership tables. Thus 18 minor rounds. 2 thoughts A- no automatic relegation, it would be up to the premier of Div 2 to decide if they want to go up and must nominate by say the 1st of October. The same for Div 2 to 3.
B- it would let Div 2 clubs know how they stand if they wanted to go up plus its fun to throw a cat among the pigeons, so put a challenge out there especially an advantage on the premiership table and bragging rights if upsets occurred.
Div 3 will have to play 4 times against some of the other clubs in the Div.
Or the other is 15 rounds plus the top 3 in each div and the bottom 3 in each div play each other 4 times thus only 17 rounds with an extra bye in the middle of the season. Bit boring playing clubs so frequently but would add enormous flexibility to the league and allow clubs be in perhaps a more competitive environment and the smaller clubs not forced to field teams it simply doesn't have the numbers for.

rock wrote:At what cost? Look at Echunga now, Mt Lofty are still paying off their debt and Uraidla have been propped up by Parker money but their juniors have been floundering for years. The model of all three isn't sustainable for Div 1. Then add in Torrens Valley who have been elevated by the money of Hughes still without success in Div 1. The state of their juniors is terribly low. Onkas and Ironbank are doing okay just to keep their heads above water but the reality is premiership success won't be coming anytime soon. Lobethal have put up a good fight in recent years but get tested by depth and usually fail as the season goes on. So that leaves the three clubs who are flushed with numbers, sponsors and money. This situation isnt going to change for a while. Happy to be proven wrong when the end of season comes but I think it's time some of the Div 1 smaller clubs consider where they actually fit in the HFL. I think Bridgewater have found some solace and happiness in Div 2.

Are you saying Uraidla juniors would be more successful if they didn't pay senior footballers like every other club in the league does? Would Uraidla's population suddenly increase to have 40+ kids to pick from each week like the "big clubs" have if they stopped paying senior footballers?

I know for a fact clubs like Hahndorf and Lobethal have put ALOT of effort into the juniors in the previous years and i think you can see it is starting to pay off. Lobethal have a list of mostly local players and play with very few points each game and a lot of Hahndorfs current senior players all played there juniors there so credit to them. I know other clubs have started to try but I just think maybe a few other clubs should take a leaf out of there books and start focusing a lot more on juniors as they are important to a good club.

Sorry - had to weigh in on this one!
Juniors are certainly the base for your club in HFL and this is one of the toughest aspects hills footy faces.
Echunga is fielding a full complement of junior teams and have also included an Under 8 team to go with the U9 and U11 teams in the modified rules competition.
However - our juniors still face the proposition of being thumped by the likes of Blackwood, Hahndorf and Mt Barker due to population which isn't good for them continuing to play the game long term and ultimately footy as a whole.
As much as I hate to admit it - Rock is on the money - so to speak - as now the imposed salary cap is in place the smaller population clubs just wont have the junior resource for the future coming into their senior grades and this will worsen as time goes by.
IMO - The only way forward is to structure the competition based on population - but I feel the bigger population clubs will enjoy their opportunity to possibly win a flag too much.

Correct me if I am wrong but Mt Barker don't have an A grade cricket team, which confirms population is a factor but its more important on how your club is run and its reputation.

Dutchy wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but Mt Barker don't have an A grade cricket team, which confirms population is a factor but its more important on how your club is run and its reputation.

Correct Mt Barker do not have a team in the A grade cricket comp. Lot's of theory's as to why, some of which you have identified in your post. From an outsiders perspective, any half decent cricketer who lobs in Mt Barker gets quickly picked up by Wistow, or some of the other nearby towns.

Dutchy wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but Mt Barker don't have an A grade cricket team, which confirms population is a factor but its more important on how your club is run and its reputation.

Cricket is very different from footy these day's dutchy, Hahndorf don't have an A grade in cricket either. Cricket is simply just a lack of people willing to play the game these days.

anonymousfooty wrote:I know for a fact clubs like Hahndorf and Lobethal have put ALOT of effort into the juniors in the previous years and i think you can see it is starting to pay off. Lobethal have a list of mostly local players and play with very few points each game and a lot of Hahndorfs current senior players all played there juniors there so credit to them. I know other clubs have started to try but I just think maybe a few other clubs should take a leaf out of there books and start focusing a lot more on juniors as they are important to a good club.

I agree that Hahndorf are outstanding in the way they run their juniors because personally the team that should dominate Juniors is Mt Barker considering the population. However, I know the amount of work at Ironbank we put in to get Juniors but when you have bugger all population and there is blackwood, lofty & Happy valley surrounding it is always going to be hard. It's easy to say rely on Juniors but there is no way we could compete with essentially an all local side and the same goes for TV, Echunga & Uraidla. I'd say Echunga have done a terrific job over the past few years to get junior numbers but it's still hard for them to win to many games, which is similar to us.

If every A grade side was just a local side it would be a pretty lopsided competition, which is why you have to have a big focus on recruits as well for smaller clubs. Uraidla have done an outstanding job of it and deserve credit, same as Echunga.

batmanbegins wrote:

Dutchy wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but Mt Barker don't have an A grade cricket team, which confirms population is a factor but its more important on how your club is run and its reputation.

Cricket is very different from footy these day's dutchy, Hahndorf don't have an A grade in cricket either. Cricket is simply just a lack of people willing to play the game these days.

anonymousfooty wrote:I know for a fact clubs like Hahndorf and Lobethal have put ALOT of effort into the juniors in the previous years and i think you can see it is starting to pay off. Lobethal have a list of mostly local players and play with very few points each game and a lot of Hahndorfs current senior players all played there juniors there so credit to them. I know other clubs have started to try but I just think maybe a few other clubs should take a leaf out of there books and start focusing a lot more on juniors as they are important to a good club.

I agree that Hahndorf are outstanding in the way they run their juniors because personally the team that should dominate Juniors is Mt Barker considering the population. However, I know the amount of work at Ironbank we put in to get Juniors but when you have bugger all population and there is blackwood, lofty & Happy valley surrounding it is always going to be hard. It's easy to say rely on Juniors but there is no way we could compete with essentially an all local side and the same goes for TV, Echunga & Uraidla. I'd say Echunga have done a terrific job over the past few years to get junior numbers but it's still hard for them to win to many games, which is similar to us.

If every A grade side was just a local side it would be a pretty lopsided competition, which is why you have to have a big focus on recruits as well for smaller clubs. Uraidla have done an outstanding job of it and deserve credit, same as Echunga.

I got my boys up at Ironbank last year and really enjoy it. We could have gone to Happy Valley, which is just up the road or even Flagstaff Hill. But we got asked by one of the coaches who also coaches at the same cricket club as me. My boys know quite a number of the kids there and have fitted in really well. We are really impressed with the way the club has accepted us and the boys are loving it (much to my wife's disgust as she don't like football)

Apart from Bridgewater Callington (which geographically seems an odd combination, but I suppose so does Mt Torrens and Mt Pleasant with Birdwood in the middle ?) When was the last merger of clubs in the Hills? Is there not the opportunity to bring two towns together? Maccie/Meadows, Kangarilla-ironbank, Gum/Birdwood? I read an article on Eudunda Robertstown merger a while back and they are two dying towns but seem pretty competitive against the thriving Clare area? Would that not work in the Hills? Or is it fear of lost identity and pride getting in the way?

wazzal77 wrote:Apart from Bridgewater Callington (which geographically seems an odd combination, but I suppose so does Mt Torrens and Mt Pleasant with Birdwood in the middle ?) When was the last merger of clubs in the Hills? Is there not the opportunity to bring two towns together? Maccie/Meadows, Kangarilla-ironbank, Gum/Birdwood? I read an article on Eudunda Robertstown merger a while back and they are two dying towns but seem pretty competitive against the thriving Clare area? Would that not work in the Hills? Or is it fear of lost identity and pride getting in the way?

I'm thinking the last real merger (Uraidla/Eastern Ranges was more of a takeover) before Torrens Valley was Lenswood Ranges & Ashton forming Eastern Ranges in the 80's. Before that I reckon it was Heathfield/Aldgate United & Stirling to form Mt Lofty???

cracka wrote:

wazzal77 wrote:Apart from Bridgewater Callington (which geographically seems an odd combination, but I suppose so does Mt Torrens and Mt Pleasant with Birdwood in the middle ?) When was the last merger of clubs in the Hills? Is there not the opportunity to bring two towns together? Maccie/Meadows, Kangarilla-ironbank, Gum/Birdwood? I read an article on Eudunda Robertstown merger a while back and they are two dying towns but seem pretty competitive against the thriving Clare area? Would that not work in the Hills? Or is it fear of lost identity and pride getting in the way?

I'm thinking the last real merger (Uraidla/Eastern Ranges was more of a takeover) before Torrens Valley was Lenswood Ranges & Ashton forming Eastern Ranges in the 80's. Before that I reckon it was Heathfield/Aldgate United & Stirling to form Mt Lofty???

The Lenswood/Ashton merge was a long time ago. I recall playing footy at both those grounds, against the then local teams. The fog was always an issue at Ashton. Recall playing Eastern Ranges at Lenswood one day. Our mob kicked 40 goals, and the locals kicked about 25.... high scoring ground!

What year was the merger Cracka?

Corona Man wrote:

cracka wrote:

wazzal77 wrote:Apart from Bridgewater Callington (which geographically seems an odd combination, but I suppose so does Mt Torrens and Mt Pleasant with Birdwood in the middle ?) When was the last merger of clubs in the Hills? Is there not the opportunity to bring two towns together? Maccie/Meadows, Kangarilla-ironbank, Gum/Birdwood? I read an article on Eudunda Robertstown merger a while back and they are two dying towns but seem pretty competitive against the thriving Clare area? Would that not work in the Hills? Or is it fear of lost identity and pride getting in the way?

I'm thinking the last real merger (Uraidla/Eastern Ranges was more of a takeover) before Torrens Valley was Lenswood Ranges & Ashton forming Eastern Ranges in the 80's. Before that I reckon it was Heathfield/Aldgate United & Stirling to form Mt Lofty???

The Lenswood/Ashton merge was a long time ago. I recall playing footy at both those grounds, against the then local teams. The fog was always an issue at Ashton. Recall playing Eastern Ranges at Lenswood one day. Our mob kicked 40 goals, and the locals kicked about 25.... high scoring ground!

What year was the merger Cracka?

I think it was 83 when all clubs (14 or 15) played in 1 big comp. Pretty sure that was the least amount of clubs in the HFL in any 1 season.

For anyone interested the most was in 1972 with 26 clubs having an A and/or B grade plus Palmer had just a B grade.

I can remember in Mini colts playing Lenswood Ranges at Lenswood & then later playing against Eastern Ranges at both Ashton & Lenswood. Ashton had pretty good facilities from what I remember, think its now a soccer club using it.

Corona Man wrote:^ spot on Rock.... A 4 team comp in Div 1 really would be the ducks nuts!

Thats the way it looks in its current environment CM. I don't have a lot of answers but perhaps capping junior teams might help. I've heard it is quite effective in other leagues. It will stop mass domination of these larger clubs. I know something needs to be done soon.

Peakedinhighschool wrote:

rock wrote:At what cost? Look at Echunga now, Mt Lofty are still paying off their debt and Uraidla have been propped up by Parker money but their juniors have been floundering for years. The model of all three isn't sustainable for Div 1. Then add in Torrens Valley who have been elevated by the money of Hughes still without success in Div 1. The state of their juniors is terribly low. Onkas and Ironbank are doing okay just to keep their heads above water but the reality is premiership success won't be coming anytime soon. Lobethal have put up a good fight in recent years but get tested by depth and usually fail as the season goes on. So that leaves the three clubs who are flushed with numbers, sponsors and money. This situation isnt going to change for a while. Happy to be proven wrong when the end of season comes but I think it's time some of the Div 1 smaller clubs consider where they actually fit in the HFL. I think Bridgewater have found some solace and happiness in Div 2.

Are you saying Uraidla juniors would be more successful if they didn't pay senior footballers like every other club in the league does? Would Uraidla's population suddenly increase to have 40+ kids to pick from each week like the "big clubs" have if they stopped paying senior footballers?

No, I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion. What I'm saying is Parker money has helped the senior teams to quite a lot of success and that's fine. Unfortunately junior numbers have been dire at Uraidla for a long time now and that will affect them at senior level in the very near future. Torrens Valley are in the same boat they just haven't had the Div 1 success Uraidla have.

rock wrote:

Corona Man wrote:^ spot on Rock.... A 4 team comp in Div 1 really would be the ducks nuts!

Thats the way it looks in its current environment CM. I don't have a lot of answers but perhaps capping junior teams might help. I've heard it is quite effective in other leagues. It will stop mass domination of these larger clubs. I know something needs to be done soon.

What country footy leagues cap junior numbers.