2nd call

[Blue Boy]

I reckon Wingfield would be filthy.....might have cost themselves the double chance!

Cant rely on the SAAFL to bail em out.

I dont think it is a bail out situation for the clubs.

I think the SAAFL have handled this badly as most clubs have paid and they are using this as a cop out. They have stated that they ( SAAFL ) work on a shoe string budget and should not have to take up the slack.

Newsflash for the SAAFL - Clubs rely on volunteers to run them and put the sides on the park every week and it is an amateur competition !!! Some people @ clubs work there normal jobs and then probably put in 40 hours in at there clubs to run them and to put a side on the park for there clubs every week - the SAAFL have slapped these people in the face as well !!!

Also with the compulsory SAAFL shorts and SAAFL socks that must be worn it has probably knocked a couple of clubs around !!!

As ( blublurag ) said a fine would be the penalty for late payment. If the SAAFL have clubs that do not pay at all then the SAAFL must ask why do they put in a team at all !!

Me thinks that a couple of people have been watchin to much AFL at Amateur House !!!

[dont think do]

Ok clubs are crying poor and have not been able to pay the money for thier 2nd call, I think what has been done is the right thing. No point in adding a fine on to the amount they are already not able to pay.

If clubs get off thier backside and ask for extra time I am sure it is given.

[blublurag]

A scenario to ponder....

Round 18, you are sitting 6th with 52%, 5th is on the same wins but 53%, they are playing the 7th side and you are playing the 2nd side. Your side puts up a really good performance but goes down by 2 points, your percentage stays the same. The other side get thumped, their percentage drops to 51%, yippee you are in the finals, and after your last performance against the 2nd side you are premiership contenders. Oh no, the 7th side hasn't paid their call, their score gets wiped, the team you are fighting for 5th spot with has their percentage go back to 53%, you lose your finals spot, and you did everything right to be there.

Or maybe you get relegated, or maybe you miss out on the double chance, maybe you don't get top spot.

The point is that the premiership tables have now been compromised.

[Blue Boy]

A scenario to ponder....

Round 18, you are sitting 6th with 52%, 5th is on the same wins but 53%, they are playing the 7th side and you are playing the 2nd side. Your side puts up a really good performance but goes down by 2 points, your percentage stays the same. The other side get thumped, their percentage drops to 51%, yippee you are in the finals, and after your last performance against the 2nd side you are premiership contenders. Oh no, the 7th side hasn't paid their call, their score gets wiped, the team you are fighting for 5th spot with has their percentage go back to 53%, you lose your finals spot, and you did everything right to be there.

Or maybe you get relegated, or maybe you miss out on the double chance, maybe you don't get top spot.

The point is that the premiership tables have now been compromised.

Nice scenario - and this is the can of worms the SAAFL have opened !!!

[stan]

A scenario to ponder....

Round 18, you are sitting 6th with 52%, 5th is on the same wins but 53%, they are playing the 7th side and you are playing the 2nd side. Your side puts up a really good performance but goes down by 2 points, your percentage stays the same. The other side get thumped, their percentage drops to 51%, yippee you are in the finals, and after your last performance against the 2nd side you are premiership contenders. Oh no, the 7th side hasn't paid their call, their score gets wiped, the team you are fighting for 5th spot with has their percentage go back to 53%, you lose your finals spot, and you did everything right to be there.

Or maybe you get relegated, or maybe you miss out on the double chance, maybe you don't get top spot.

The point is that the premiership tables have now been compromised.

Nice scenario - and this is the can of worms the SAAFL have opened !!!

Thats a very good point there Bluerag. Also carey brought up a good point as well. If those games were always going to be dud games, then the game should have just been forfited instead of playing the game and then having the points removed. Could you imagine if you lost a key player to a injury in a game that well meant nothing as the points were already yours. Thats also another can that could have been opened. Not sure if it has as i dont know of any instances.

[blublurag]

I am not sure I agree with the forfeit solution. I think all of the scenarios can still occur if there is a forfeit imposed. Also, it would really hurt if you had a home game all ready to go and the visiting team is forced to forfeit. That again hurts the Club that has done the right thing. The Raggies lost 3 players in that Pooraka game but to me that is par for the course. It was certainly better to play the game than have a forfeit.

The system should only punish the team that has defaulted. That can be achieved (although I am sure the scoring system IScore would need to be modified). Here goes...

If a winning team defaults, they lose the 2 points and their score. The 2 points DO NOT go to the losing club and the losing clubs For/against remains the same as if they played a legitimate game.

If a losing team defaults, they lose their score. The winning clubs For/against remains the same as if they played a legitimate game.

This way ONLY the defaulting club is penalised.

By the way, in the scenario from my previous post, it is even worse, as the team that pipped you by percentage also got the 2 points, therefore percentage didn't matter.

[carey]

the 3rd calls came out today ( 14/06/06 ) i just wander how many clubs have learnt from the 2nd calls not being paid

[Pag]

I am not sure I agree with the forfeit solution. I think all of the scenarios can still occur if there is a forfeit imposed. Also, it would really hurt if you had a home game all ready to go and the visiting team is forced to forfeit. That again hurts the Club that has done the right thing. The Raggies lost 3 players in that Pooraka game but to me that is par for the course. It was certainly better to play the game than have a forfeit.

I think I read somewhere that Shadiac said the games will not be forfeited due to keeping things like Association Medal Votes and Division Goalkicking tables fair, and not penalising the players representing both the 'innocent' club and the unpaid club that are involved in the match.

If the match was to be forfeited, and it was say Blackfriars vs Western Warriors in Div 7, I'm sure CJ would say that a 60-point win would probably not do Blackfrias justice, as it's probably penalising them percentage as well?

[cj_blacks]

shhhhhhh

[Blue Boy]

A meeting tomorrow night.

The clubs may get the points back if 51% of all other clubs agree !!!

[Bluedemon]

blue boy, was this sent out to all the clubs to attend?

[Blue Boy]

blue boy, was this sent out to all the clubs to attend?

not sure on that !!!!!

will look in to it !!!

[Barbara]

Did the meeting happen? If so, the outcome?

[BM]

Barbara pretty sure the meeting did not take place. Considering Gepps were one of the teams involved with this fiasco we were not notified of any meeting.

[Jimmy]

very interesting to see a couple of tems lose points from the weekend for not paying there 2nd call.modbury in div 2,north pines,pooraka and the best one western warriors have had there first win thanks to wingfeild royals!

what is 'not paying their second call'???? ive never heard this b4???

[heater31]

its the fees each club pays to league and its paid in installments throughout the year as the club generates some cash.

[Blue Boy]

Did the meeting happen? If so, the outcome?

It now will happen in 2 weeks @ the next compulsary delegates meeting. This means each club must have the clubs nominated delegate attend the meeting.

This meeting is not specificly for this matter - it is just one of the things that will be on the agenda for this meeting.

The SAAFL notifies all clubs that a meeting is compulsary and when it is.

So in a nut shell still a couple of weeks before any decision is made !!!

[carey18]

how about you just decide who plays finals at the meeting as well?.wouldnt want to follow the rules the league sets down would we!

[Blue Boy]

Barbara pretty sure the meeting did not take place. Considering Gepps were one of the teams involved with this fiasco we were not notified of any meeting.

What does Gepps think of the whole fiasco i have given a couple of scenario's in which way things may go !!!

Scenario One :
All results to stand as played - yet fines still apply and payable

Scenario Two :
The defaulting clubs that won still lose the win but the points scored still remain - but the other team that lost does not get the win either as the default is worded that way

[Blue Boy]

how about you just decide who plays finals at the meeting as well?.wouldnt want to follow the rules the league sets down would we!

In this case the rules that were sent seem to be a little clouded and in some instances not received as they are only sent via email.

The email system is meant to be in a transitional year for the 2006 season.

Since this fiasco the SAAFL have released in the latest newsletter this information.

Gate Keeper on Mail
Please delete emails that are no longer relevant
to keep your email box clear. There is a limited storage capacity in these boxes.

In this case I think some one knows that that they could of been getting emails bounce back !!!

I think you will find all this has come about because 18 clubs were not financial at the 1st call. Some of the 4 clubs that were penalised on the second call were not part of the 18 clubs listed on the first call.