by no_remorse28 » Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:29 am
by Footy Chick » Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:47 am
Gatt_Weasel wrote:if they (Walkerville) dont win the flag ill run around the block of my street naked :) you can grab a chair and enjoy the view
by no_remorse28 » Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:57 am
Footy Chick wrote:So you don't mind working over the holiday then either?
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:12 am
Old Dog New Tricks wrote:Are you sure about that or are you just grabbing pieces of the LL Act or shoppies for that matter to suit your self fulfilling argumentmorell wrote:For example, it is in South Australia's liquor licensing act that you are unable to sell alcohol on Good Friday. Shops are unable to open
by jo172 » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:16 am
morell wrote:Old Dog New Tricks wrote:Are you sure about that or are you just grabbing pieces of the LL Act or shoppies for that matter to suit your self fulfilling argumentmorell wrote:For example, it is in South Australia's liquor licensing act that you are unable to sell alcohol on Good Friday. Shops are unable to open
http://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/LZ/C/A/LIQUOR%20LICENSING%20ACT%201997/2004.03.24/1997.65.PDF
There are Good Friday restrictions on ALL of the different types of licenses:
Hotel licence
32. (1) A hotel licence authorises the licensee
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises for consumption on or off the licensed premises
on any day (except Sunday, Good Friday and Christmas Day) between 5 am and
midnight; and
Residential licence
33. (1) A residential licence
(b) if the conditions of the licence so provide—authorises the licensee to sell liquor on any
day except Good Friday and Christmas Day for consumption on the licensed premises
Restaurant licence
34. (1) A restaurant licence—
(c) if the conditions of the licence so provide—authorises the licensee to sell liquor on any
day except Good Friday and Christmas Day for consumption on the licensed premises by
persons
Club licence
36. (1) A club licence authorises the licensee—
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises for consumption on the licensed premises on any
day (except Sunday, Good Friday and Christmas Day)
Retail liquor merchant’s licence
37. (1) A retail liquor merchant’s licence authorises the licensee—
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises on any day except Good Friday and Christmas
Day
etc ...
In a modern western democracy, where the constitution is explicit in it's secular intention and separation of church and state is one of the core tenements, this is galling and reeks of some crusty old god botherers sneaking in their sky daddy where he/she/it isn't welcome.
But I'm not that fussed really, I'm not going to go marching in the streets about it, but it shits me that Good Friday is treated with this sort of over the top revered status, and ANZAC Day is not - including the notion of playing football on said days. I would prefer to play footy on Good Friday, and leave ANZAC Day the **** alone, as an idea.
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:18 am
Footy Chick wrote:So you don't mind working over the holiday then either?
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:25 am
This is an argument that is usually used because no one has successfully challenged the high courts by leveraging section 116 - the sole reason for that is because it's exceedingly difficult to actually define what is and is not "religion" in a court of law - which makes sense, you can't disprove belief. That doesn't mean it's not clear that it was intended on being implemented to ensure the previous histories religious malarkey isn't repeated:jo172 wrote:morell wrote:In a modern western democracy, where the constitution is explicit in it's secular intention and separation of church and state is one of the core tenements, this is galling and reeks of some crusty old god botherers sneaking in their sky daddy where he/she/it isn't welcome.
But I'm not that fussed really, I'm not going to go marching in the streets about it, but it shits me that Good Friday is treated with this sort of over the top revered status, and ANZAC Day is not - including the notion of playing football on said days. I would prefer to play footy on Good Friday, and leave ANZAC Day the **** alone, as an idea.
High Court disagrees fwiw
section 116 is a limit on Federal Power rather than designed to express any secular intention
Section 116 of the Constitution of Australia precludes the Commonwealth of Australia (i.e., the federal parliament) from making laws for establishing any religion, imposing any religious observance, or prohibiting the free exercise of any religion. Section 116 also provides that no religious test shall be required as a qualification for any office or public trust under the Commonwealth. The product of a compromise in the pre-Federation constitutional conventions, Section 116 is based on similar provision
by Footy Chick » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:29 am
morell wrote:
In fact, it could very much be argued, that our entire system of government, political process and western culture is based on separating religious thinking from law making.
Gatt_Weasel wrote:if they (Walkerville) dont win the flag ill run around the block of my street naked :) you can grab a chair and enjoy the view
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:32 am
Sure, in 1650, this was spot on.Footy Chick wrote:morell wrote:
In fact, it could very much be argued, that our entire system of government, political process and western culture is based on separating religious thinking from law making.
Legal Studies 101... Political, judicial, and the church, the law making triangle.
Thank you Westminster (not the football club)
by jo172 » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:43 am
morell wrote:This is an argument that is usually used because no one has successfully challenged the high courts by leveraging section 116 - the sole reason for that is because it's exceedingly difficult to actually define what is and is not "religion" in a court of law - which makes sense, you can't disprove belief. That doesn't mean it's not clear that it was intended on being implemented to ensure the previous histories religious malarkey isn't repeated:jo172 wrote:morell wrote:In a modern western democracy, where the constitution is explicit in it's secular intention and separation of church and state is one of the core tenements, this is galling and reeks of some crusty old god botherers sneaking in their sky daddy where he/she/it isn't welcome.
But I'm not that fussed really, I'm not going to go marching in the streets about it, but it shits me that Good Friday is treated with this sort of over the top revered status, and ANZAC Day is not - including the notion of playing football on said days. I would prefer to play footy on Good Friday, and leave ANZAC Day the **** alone, as an idea.
High Court disagrees fwiw
section 116 is a limit on Federal Power rather than designed to express any secular intention
For those playing at home:Section 116 of the Constitution of Australia precludes the Commonwealth of Australia (i.e., the federal parliament) from making laws for establishing any religion, imposing any religious observance, or prohibiting the free exercise of any religion. Section 116 also provides that no religious test shall be required as a qualification for any office or public trust under the Commonwealth. The product of a compromise in the pre-Federation constitutional conventions, Section 116 is based on similar provision
In fact, it could very much be argued, that our entire system of government, political process and western culture is based on separating religious thinking from law making.
by Footy Chick » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:50 am
morell wrote:Sure, in 1650, this was spot on.Footy Chick wrote:morell wrote:
In fact, it could very much be argued, that our entire system of government, political process and western culture is based on separating religious thinking from law making.
Legal Studies 101... Political, judicial, and the church, the law making triangle.
Thank you Westminster (not the football club)
EDIT: But did you actually get taught this?
Gatt_Weasel wrote:if they (Walkerville) dont win the flag ill run around the block of my street naked :) you can grab a chair and enjoy the view
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:06 am
Everyone now and then, very rarely, you get a post that makes you smile and nod your head with respect. This is one of those posts.jo172 wrote:This is incorrect, for a start section 116 has no application to the states (see Attorney-General (Vic); Ex rel Black v Commonwealth. There is nothing in the constitution prohibiting the South Australian parliament declaring Scientology the state religion tomorrow.
The same case above held that the intention of section 116 is to prevent the setting up of a state church. There is nothing to indicate a positive duty of secularism (aside from arguably that religion may not be required as a qualification for any office under the Commonwealth).
Also, the High Court has considered what a religion is in Church of the New Faith v Commisioner of Pay-roll Tax (Vic) where it considered whether Scientology was a religion for the purposes of Victorian Taxation exemptions.
The existence of these exemptions, along with the High Court permitting religious funding by the Government is evidence in itself that there's not a secular intent in our Constitution such as in the American Constitution.
by Dogwatcher » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:11 am
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:27 am
by Footy Chick » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:31 am
Dogwatcher wrote:Football thread?
Gatt_Weasel wrote:if they (Walkerville) dont win the flag ill run around the block of my street naked :) you can grab a chair and enjoy the view
by no_remorse28 » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:50 am
by Old Dog New Tricks » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:02 pm
So, in some circumstances, liquor can be sold and not universally banned as you've suggested.morell wrote:Old Dog New Tricks wrote:Are you sure about that or are you just grabbing pieces of the LL Act or shoppies for that matter to suit your self fulfilling argumentmorell wrote:For example, it is in South Australia's liquor licensing act that you are unable to sell alcohol on Good Friday. Shops are unable to open
http://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/LZ/C/A/LIQUOR%20LICENSING%20ACT%201997/2004.03.24/1997.65.PDF
There are Good Friday restrictions on ALL of the different types of licenses:
Hotel licence
32. (1) A hotel licence authorises the licensee
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises for consumption on or off the licensed premises
on any day (except Sunday, Good Friday and Christmas Day) between 5 am and
midnight; and
Residential licence
33. (1) A residential licence
(b) if the conditions of the licence so provide—authorises the licensee to sell liquor on any
day except Good Friday and Christmas Day for consumption on the licensed premises
Restaurant licence
34. (1) A restaurant licence—
(c) if the conditions of the licence so provide—authorises the licensee to sell liquor on any
day except Good Friday and Christmas Day for consumption on the licensed premises by
persons
Club licence
36. (1) A club licence authorises the licensee—
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises for consumption on the licensed premises on any
day (except Sunday, Good Friday and Christmas Day)
Retail liquor merchant’s licence
37. (1) A retail liquor merchant’s licence authorises the licensee—
(a) to sell liquor on the licensed premises on any day except Good Friday and Christmas
Day
etc ...
In a modern western democracy, where the constitution is explicit in it's secular intention and separation of church and state is one of the core tenements, this is galling and reeks of some crusty old god botherers sneaking in their sky daddy where he/she/it isn't welcome.
But I'm not that fussed really, I'm not going to go marching in the streets about it, but it shits me that Good Friday is treated with this sort of over the top revered status, and ANZAC Day is not - including the notion of playing football on said days. I would prefer to play footy on Good Friday, and leave ANZAC Day the **** alone, as an idea.
by Old Dog New Tricks » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:33 pm
As I asked, so you can sell liquor on Good Friday.morell wrote:
by morell » Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:15 pm
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