BRETT LEE

[Rik E Boy]

Yep, White for Cullen that's for sure.

regards,

REB

[mal]

Brett Lee stats in test cricket.

Career 219 wickets @ 32-43
2006....031 wickets @ 35-97
2005....020 wickets @ 41-40

As I suspected his last 2 years have been very ordinary for a strike bowler.
With the constant pressure on batsman by Warrrrrney and Mcgrath you would
think Lee would have had a better average than the 38 in the last 2 years

People have been spoilt by the teams winning sequences in tests which has
masked the inadequecies of the former top flight fast bowler.

Lee the BEST o/d day bowler in the world is basking on his sensational o/d expliots.

He needs to lift his game as the next generation of TAIT/JOHNSON/HILFENHAUS
are ready to take his spot.

[Blue Boy]

Lee the BEST o/d day bowler in the world is basking on his sensational o/d expliots.

.

Sorry Mal

I dont think he is the best one day bowler in the world !!!

[Blue Boy]

Lee the BEST o/d day bowler in the world is basking on his sensational o/d expliots.

.

Sorry Mal

I dont think he is the best one day bowler in the world !!!

Current ICC One day Bowlers rankings

1 S.M. Pollock SA
2 G.D. McGrath AUS
3 N.W. Bracken AUS
4 I.D.R. Bradshaw WI
5 M. Ntini SA
6 B. Lee AUS
7 S.E. Bond NZ
8 D.L. Vettori NZ
9 M. Muralidaran SL
10 W.P.U.J.C. Vaas SL


I was sure Mcgrath would be higher but Braken does suprise me !!!

[mal]

BLUE BOY over the last 5 years in my opinion he is the best o/d bowler
in the world, others have good years and rate higher on occasions.
And that list is suspect when Watson who has an average 0f 19 cant make the top 10

[rod_rooster]

And that list is suspect when Watson who has an average 0f 19 cant make the top 10

Oh dear

Watson isn't in the best 10 bowlers in Australia in any form of cricket let alone the world.

[another grub]

Watsons bowling is ordinary, he cant do anything with the ball.

[Blue Boy]

BLUE BOY over the last 5 years in my opinion he is the best o/d bowler
in the world, others have good years and rate higher on occasions.
And that list is suspect when Watson who has an average 0f 19 cant make the top 10

No worries - just not a fan !!!

[Silky skills]

Rod i couldnt agree with you more henriques will be as good as Flintoff if not better, and also wtf's with Bracken being number 3 in the bowling rankings, he couldnt get a bowl in a chinese restaurant, seriously Watson's a better bowler

[mal]

Rod i couldnt agree with you more henriques will be as good as Flintoff if not better, and also wtf's with Bracken being number 3 in the bowling rankings, he couldnt get a bowl in a chinese restaurant, seriously Watson's a better bowler

SILKY leave the brash and stupid predictions to me, I get most of them right.
To suggest HenREBiques will be as good or better than Flintoff is too big an ask.
Easier to say he will be a star or will play for Australia etc.
And you will have Hawks and Roosters gunning for you

Now the real reson I wanted to post

BRETT LEE 6 wickets in the 4th test, hes baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack.
Come on Brett youve been ordinary for 2 years and been carried.
Hopefully this is the turning point for the likeable fast bowler.
A late xmas present for AH

[Adelaide Hawk]

BRETT LEE 6 wickets in the 4th test, hes baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack.
Come on Brett youve been ordinary for 2 years and been carried.
Hopefully this is the turning point for the likeable fast bowler.
A late xmas present for AH

I'm not too sure about Lee being ordinary for the past 2 years.

In the Ashes of 2005 he took 20 wickets @ 31.10 in 5 Tests. Best 4/82
2005-06 v West Indies 18 wickets @ 20.94 3 Tests. Best 5/30
2005-06 v South Africa 13 wickets @ 32.38 3 Tests Best 5/93
2005-06 v South Africa 17 wickets @ 19.53 3 Tests Best 5/69
2006-07 v England 14 wickets @ 39.57 4 Tests Best 4/51

The only other tests played in this time was the World XI and Bangladesh Tests, and who cares about those?

I think Lee's performances overall in the past 2 years have been very good.

[mal]

BRETT LEE 6 wickets in the 4th test, hes baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack.
Come on Brett youve been ordinary for 2 years and been carried.
Hopefully this is the turning point for the likeable fast bowler.
A late xmas present for AH

I'm not too sure about Lee being ordinary for the past 2 years.

In the Ashes of 2005 he took 20 wickets @ 31.10 in 5 Tests. Best 4/82
2005-06 v West Indies 18 wickets @ 20.94 3 Tests. Best 5/30
2005-06 v South Africa 13 wickets @ 32.38 3 Tests Best 5/93
2005-06 v South Africa 17 wickets @ 19.53 3 Tests Best 5/69
2006-07 v England 14 wickets @ 39.57 4 Tests Best 4/51

The only other tests played in this time was the World XI and Bangladesh Tests, and who cares about those?

I think Lee's performances overall in the past 2 years have been very good.

AH whose wrong ? stats for 2005/2006
---------------------------------------------------------
The paper said he averages 38[before this test]...........BLOODY LIARS NOT MY FAULT !!
AH figures above say he averages 28[after this test]
Mal finds the average at 32-80[after this test]

Your 2005 stats EG V AU 20 wickets at 31-10 should be 20 wickets for 822 at 41-10

You convieniently left out the world X1 stats 1/96 at 96-00
You convieniently left out the Bangladesh stats 2/186 at 93-00

Lees career averages after each series 1999-2006
------------------------------------------------------------

IN 99-00...14-15
NZ99-00...16-06
WI 00-01...16-07
EG 01-01...22-96
NZ 01-02...23-43
SA 01-02...26-82
PA 02-03...27-94
EG 02-03...29-64
WI 02-03...29-53
BA 03-03...29-63
ZI 03-04....29-97
IN 03-04...31-67
_______________

EG 05-05...32-86
WX 05-06..33-04
WI 05-06...31-83
SA 05-06...30-86
BA 05-06...31-45
EG 05-06...32-80

Interesting how Lee burst on the scene in 1999 and has got his average up up up
Apart from the WI/SA series in 05-06 where he went from 33-04 to 30-86
But the figure has climbed back to 32-80
His career ave in 2005-2006 dropped from 32-86 to 32-80


2005/2006 STATS
--------------------

EG 20/822
WX 01/96
WI 18/377
SA 30/753
BA 02/186
EG 14/544

= 85/2788 AVE 32.80 IN 2005/2006

Looking at those stats he is just a bowler in 2005-2006
Overall his brilliant bowling in his first few years has kept his average below 40

Dont use the Mcgrath/Warne theory of taking wickets makes it harder for Lee
Especially in 2006 when Clark averages about 19 in 2006

Meet you half way AH, the advertiser misled my stats, settle for 33 ave ???????

[am Bays]

Brett Lee is at his best when he pitches the ball up and gets the ball to hoop around at 145km/h + as we saw in England last year and in this last test

When he gets on the bouncier tracks (Perth and brisbane) he gets all happy and starts bnging it in short and loses his shape so he just becomes GBS (gun barrel straight) and good test batsmen can pick him off or smash him to the boundary....

Hopefully in the last five years of his career he becomes a more cerebral bowler, pitches it up and uses reverse and conventional swing to gets batsmen out as he has shown that he can do that. At the same time he leaves the short sh!t alone and uses it a variation to keep the batsmen on the back pole making them more likely to get a nick as they don't get as far forward as they should when it is pitched up....

[Adelaide Hawk]

I still think people are missing the point entirely with Lee. They haven't wanted him to bowl like McGrath, Gillespie or Clark. They've had plenty of bowlers who can do that. What they have wanted from him is the added variety of pure pace. Do you honestly feel Lee would still be in the team and taking the new ball if he wasn't doing what he was asked? Of course not.

Waugh in particular just wanted Lee to bowl flat out at all times. This meant spells where he bowled some crap, because it's damned hard bowling express pace, but when he got it right, look out. If Australia had been struggling over the years, maybe Lee would be a problem, but we have been WINNING .. and winning well, and Lee has been playing his part.

The very best thing that could happen to Lee is if they selected Tait in the side. There wouldn't be as much pressure on Lee to bowl express and he could then do what he does best. It reminds me a little of when Jeff Thomson made the Aussie team. Lillee was coming back from his injury, and having Thommo in the team was the best thing ever to happen to Lillee. He would not have been able to lead that attack on his own, and with Thommo firing thunderbolts, Lillee supported him brilliantly.

I honestly think most people underestimate the effect of Lee's presence in that team. No matter how many runs opposition batsmen may score from him, they never enjoy facing him, and it would weigh at the back of their minds that at any time the Aussies will swing him into the attack and he could cause some damge.

What a player brings to a team is an aspect very much understood by the general public who just like to point at statistics as a measuring stick. Sure, there will always come a time when a player has to put the score on the board, but while the team is winning and the player is doing his bit, then he deserves to be in the team.

Andrew Symonds copped the same crap from people because he wasn't belting 100s like Ponting, Hussey and Gilchrist. However, what he brought to the team was his presence in the rooms, his ability to bowl medium pacers or offies when required, his outstanding fielding which lifted the standard, and the potential that he could at any time walk in and make a big 100 like he did at the MCG. Prior to that he wasn't putting the score on the board, but he was still contributing.

I guess the thing that staggers me is there will be Lee, standing in the middle of the ground, holding up the ball with which he just claimed his 300th Test wicket, and there will STILL be people questioning his place in the team. Craziness.

[Adelaide Hawk]

Your 2005 stats EG V AU 20 wickets at 31-10 should be 20 wickets for 822 at 41-10

Yes, quite right. The stats I got were from my own library and unfortunately at the end of the series I carried over 622 instead of 822.

However, that doesn't alter my assessment of Lee as a bowler. Unlike a lot of people, I can assess a player's worth without needing to look at a page full of statistics that may or may not be misleading.

[am Bays]

I hear what you are saying AH but test cricket is not just about running in and bowling fast, cast your mind back three years ago Steve Waughs last test, Lee came flying in against quality batsmen bowled short of a length - didn't allow the ball to swing - 720 runs later......

Last year agaisnt Lara at Adelaide......

2001-02 in Perth against Parore, Vincent, Astle and Fleming bowling 155 km/h they all cashed in with tons.....

This year against Cook (hardly one of teh great test batsmen) in Perth.....

I will acknowledge though he was no robinson crusoe in those tests too in bowling carp at times....

Quality test batsman love fast bowling that is straight like Lee is when he tries to bowl quick, however drop 5 km off the pace but swing it they hate it - as told to me by a test (opening) batsman three years ago....

FWIW I think Lee is capable of finishing of upwards of 400 test wickets and he should as he is a more than handy cricketer - he just has to be smart enough to change his game plan especially in three years time when his stock ball will be below 140 km/h.....

I believe you point about Tait helping Lee is a good one, the selectors need to be mindfull of not wasting Taits express speed that he currently has, which will dimish the longer he is out of the test side....

[mal]

AH I applaud you for defending your man.
You say stats are not always a true guide in assessing the VALUE of a cricketer
and I have to agree with that.
I say you can carry a guy with a 32 average because hes fast and adds variation
So if he has been sacrificed for the TEAM then thats fine by me.
Symonds stats are the same, his VALUE defies his averages

However after the 5th test, his role is the spearhead + the most experienced
of the quick bowlers and what he does from now on counts.
Then MT79,Tassie, AH and Mal can adjudicate further

[bay boy]

Brett Lee is marginally better than his fat brother Shane !! That's how high I rate him

If Australia's attack rests on his shoulder for the next 3 years we are in a lot of trouble. Bring Tait in straight away, Lee's had his time to shine

[mal]

Brett Lee is marginally better than his fat brother Shane !! That's how high I rate him

If Australia's attack rests on his shoulder for the next 3 years we are in a lot of trouble. Bring Tait in straight away, Lee's had his time to shine

Welcolme to the site BAYBOY.
Could nearly agree with you, but we need some experience in our attack.

[bay boy]

Lee may have experience but it means nothing as he doesnt learn from when he gets smashed around the park. He just tries to bowl faster