Australia's Greatest ODI Team

[westozfalcon]

I heard about this Cricket Australia initiative a couple of months back and kicked off a debate under the thread 'Best ever Aussie one-day side" on 18th November.

The team I picked was:-

Mark Waugh
Adam Gilchrist
Dean Jones
Greg Chappell
Allan Border (capt)
Michael Bevan
Simon O'Donnell
Shane Warne
Craig McDermott
Dennis Lillee
Glenn McGrath

12th - Peter Taylor

I just hope that some of the trailblazers of the early days of one-day cricket in this country are given recognition e.g Dean Jones, Simon O'Donnell, Dennis Lillee etc instead of just selecting all current day superstars.

[-]

Gilchrist
Mark Waugh
Ponting
Greg Chappel (c)
Dean Jones
Bevan
Symonds
Brett Lee
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

12th man Craig McDermott

Comments: You may say Dean Jones didnt bat 5. He is clearly in the best 7 one day batsman this country has seen and could bat anywhere in the order.

Symonds got ahead of O'Donnel due to being a far supeior batsman and the fact Greg chappel averages only a run or two more with the ball than O'Donnel with an economy rate of low 4's albiet in the slower days of one day cricket. So Symonds and greg Chappel are capable of being that 5th bowler with help from Mark Waugh.

The 3 legends of bowling picked themselves and it was a close shave picking Brett Lee ahead of Mcdermott. Lee is slightly more expensive however slightly more likely to take wickets. Lees handy number 8 batting was the thing that just got him over the line. Lees strike rate of 28 is better than mcdermotts 36.

[blink]

Adam Gilchrist
Mark Waugh
Ricky Ponting
Dean Jones
Steve Waugh (c)
Andrew Symonds
Michael Bevan
Shane Warne
Brett Lee
Dennis Lillee
Glenn McGrath

The first four batsmen speak for themselves. Gilchrist, M. Waugh, Ponting & Jones.
Steve Waugh was an excellent one day bowler when he began, and then went on to become one of the great batsman. As the saying went a few years back: - "You are four-for not many, who do you want to come in at 5? Steve Waugh."
Andrew Symonds is in there because of his all round ability again - batting, bowling and of course his brilliant fielding.
Michael Bevan may well have been replaced by Hussey had this been a couple of years down the track, but for now he is in.
Brett Lee scrapes in ahead of O'Donnell & McDermott - see Dasher for same reason.
The McGrath, Lillee & Warne trio are the first three picked, no brainer.

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Steve waugh is the my 13th player in the suad. Him v symonds. Steve waughs bowling early in the career was exceptional.

U cant leave out Greg Chappel. Im almost inclined to open DEANO and put swaugh in for mwaugh.

[rod_rooster]

Steve waugh is the my 13th player in the suad. Him v symonds. Steve waughs bowling early in the career was exceptional.

U cant leave out Greg Chappel. Im almost inclined to open DEANO and put swaugh in for mwaugh.

There is no way you could leave either Waugh brother out IMHO.

[devilsadvocate]

Surely Michael Bevan will get in, if only for that night in Sydney.

IMO M Bevan is Australia's greatest ever ODI player. The number of times he single handedly won a game was outstanding.

That night in Sydney is still my fondest memeroy of ODI cricket. I'll never forget it after we were dead and buried, only to have Bevan save the day as he did on so many other occasions.

With an average of 54, he's clearly the standout player, and I'd pick him first every time.

[rod_rooster]

Surely Michael Bevan will get in, if only for that night in Sydney.

IMO M Bevan is Australia's greatest ever ODI player. The number of times he single handedly won a game was outstanding.

That night in Sydney is still my fondest memeroy of ODI cricket. I'll never forget it after we were dead and buried, only to have Bevan save the day as he did on so many other occasions.

With an average of 54, he's clearly the standout player, and I'd pick him first every time.

There were many downsides to Bevan as well. No doubting he did some wonderful things for Australia in ODI's but it wasn't always the case.

[scoob]

Surely Michael Bevan will get in, if only for that night in Sydney.

IMO M Bevan is Australia's greatest ever ODI player. The number of times he single handedly won a game was outstanding.

That night in Sydney is still my fondest memeroy of ODI cricket. I'll never forget it after we were dead and buried, only to have Bevan save the day as he did on so many other occasions.

With an average of 54, he's clearly the standout player, and I'd pick him first every time.

There were many downsides to Bevan as well. No doubting he did some wonderful things for Australia in ODI's but it wasn't always the case.

Agree with you Rod, he did do some good things but always felt he tried to look after his average...was great a picking up his 2s and 3s but rarely destroyed an attack...I think i would pick 6 - 8 batsmen before he got a gig...his inability too deal witha short ball was pretty bad...

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he did seem to bat 4 his average i agree. the amount of times he rescued us was amazing tho. middle overs expert.

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I think they will go with this and leave jones out.

gily
mwaugh
pont
g chap
s waugh
bevan
symonds

[blink]

Agree with you Rod, he did do some good things but always felt he tried to look after his average...was great a picking up his 2s and 3s but rarely destroyed an attack...I think i would pick 6 - 8 batsmen before he got a gig...his inability too deal witha short ball was pretty bad...

That inability is probably what stopped him from having a longer Test career than what he did.

In ODI's, especially when Bevan was batting later in the innings, you rarely see a short ball bowled because bowlers at the death are scared of dropping one short as there is a fair chance it will either get belted, or be called an overhead wide. Not to mention they can only bowl one an over. This weakness was never exposed and expoilted to the extent that it was when Bevan played Test and Pura Cup cricket.

In contrast, Bevan was an excellent player (maybe even the best?) of all the balls and tricks that specialist last 10 over bowlers employ. Not only could he keep the dangerous ones out and punish the loose ones, he could thread those good balls for 2's & 3's through tight fields constantly.

[scoob]

He was good, not doubting that at all, but he often played out the overs out with 1 and 2's rather than having a real go at them, not willing to throw his wicket away ala gilchrist, symonds etc...

[rod_rooster]

Agree with you Rod, he did do some good things but always felt he tried to look after his average...was great a picking up his 2s and 3s but rarely destroyed an attack...I think i would pick 6 - 8 batsmen before he got a gig...his inability too deal witha short ball was pretty bad...

That inability is probably what stopped him from having a longer Test career than what he did.

In ODI's, especially when Bevan was batting later in the innings, you rarely see a short ball bowled because bowlers at the death are scared of dropping one short as there is a fair chance it will either get belted, or be called an overhead wide. Not to mention they can only bowl one an over. This weakness was never exposed and expoilted to the extent that it was when Bevan played Test and Pura Cup cricket.

In contrast, Bevan was an excellent player (maybe even the best?) of all the balls and tricks that specialist last 10 over bowlers employ. Not only could he keep the dangerous ones out and punish the loose ones, he could thread those good balls for 2's & 3's through tight fields constantly.

For the best part of Bevan's one day career bowlers weren't even able to bowl one short ball an over.

[rod_rooster]

I must say i am very surprised that so many people have left Border out of their side.

[blink]

He was good, not doubting that at all, but he often played out the overs out with 1 and 2's rather than having a real go at them, not willing to throw his wicket away ala gilchrist, symonds etc...

True scoob, but acting in the vein of Gilchrist and Symonds could be just as bad as playing for your average (which I agree Bevan did appear to do sometimes) as throwing the willow at a few then getting caught in the deep isn't always the smart option. That is why Gilchrist opens and Symonds bats at 5, around the same as Bevan, but have you ever seen Symonds save a match like Bevan?

[scoob]

He was good, not doubting that at all, but he often played out the overs out with 1 and 2's rather than having a real go at them, not willing to throw his wicket away ala gilchrist, symonds etc...

True scoob, but acting in the vein of Gilchrist and Symonds could be just as bad as playing for your average (which I agree Bevan did appear to do sometimes) as throwing the willow at a few then getting caught in the deep isn't always the smart option. That is why Gilchrist opens and Symonds bats at 5, around the same as Bevan, but have you ever seen Symonds save a match like Bevan?

He saved Australia getting knocked out of a world cup with a 140 odd, theres no excuse for not having a go in the final over or two like bevan did regularly...

[blink]

Batting first there is no problem having a go in the final overs, but chasing down a score is a different matter!!

That match that Symonds scored 140 in was Australia's first of the World Cup and I am sure that had we lost it we still would have gotten through to the final.

A few matches later in the group stage:
Australia v England, Australia were 7/114 with 108 balls left to get to the target of 209. Bevan (and Bichel) guided Australia home with an over to spare.

Then in the 2nd Super Six match:
Australia were 7/84 after 27 overs and Bevan (& Bichel again) guided Australia to a reasonable 9/208, to which Australia then defended, bowling NZ out for 112.

Compiling an innings and chasing down a difficult target I would prefer Bevan to do it for me, rather than Symonds or Gilchrist. Don't get me wrong, I think Symonds & Gilchrist are brilliant cricketers (both are in my team) but noone has saved as many ODI's for Australia than Bevan.

[scoob]

will have to agree to disagree bud...

[giffo]

A very tough task for those picking the team. Do you pick players " in position" or move them in the order to fit them in? I also think that the WSC era players should be included. These are the players who bought cricket back to the public and got them excited about the game.

[Punk Rooster]

My side is picked to "position"...
A Gilchrist
M Waugh
D Jones
G Chappell
S Waugh (c)
A Symonds
S O'Donnell
S Warne
B Lee
C McDermott
G McGrath

Batsmen
Bowler
Allrounder
Batsmen/'Keeper