Southern Football League

[Numbers]

If the SFL isn't going to look at 2 divisions, what's the forums opinion on starting a new league!

Invite 10 (maybe 12) clubs with at least 2 Saturday junior sides, reserves & A grade as a minimum!

SPFL Southern Premier Football League

Each club has 1 member on the board & the league will be run by the clubs.

[barry footynut]

If the SFL isn't going to look at 2 divisions, what's the forums opinion on starting a new league!

Invite 10 (maybe 12) clubs with at least 2 Saturday junior sides, reserves & A grade as a minimum!

SPFL Southern Premier Football League

Each club has 1 member on the board & the league will be run by the clubs.

I thought this would be a great way to head if the stubborn SFL decided not to make changes to this dying league. I posted a very similar post to yours 6-8 months ago. I think it would be very possible and create great excitement for a new chapter.

[The Angry Bull]

Admittedly I am only new to the league, however talk of forming a new league, ala ICL/USFL/Super League/Clive Palmer's Football League, makes me ponder some other 'out there' approaches that could benefit junior and senior footy in the SFL.

Firstly, the junior league would become a separate entity from the senior comp, although still tied in under the SFL moniker. This would allow you to program junior matches as normal with the aim being, pending actual participating sides, that matches are to be played before senior games still. This meaning junior footy would ultimately be decided by a board focused on junior footy but still aligned to their senior SFL club. Basically it would be a similar scenario as you find with Metro Junior Leagues, but still operated by the SFL but in our own unique way.

Now for the big boys, and this is where it gets interesting...

To steal a format from completely left field, Football in Brazil used to run two leagues within their season, an altura(sic?) and clasura(sic?) championship. What would basically happen is that each side would play each other once, then at the completion of the first round, be split in half, with the top half playing for the premiership, and the bottom half playing for a div 2 title essentially. Teams would carry over their previous points against the teams they now have in their respective 'new league' (as they do in super 6 stage at cricket world cups) and a new draw to be made, the determination of how many games to be played is not overly critical, but obviously you still have a final 4 or 5 series to determine each divisions premiership winner, which still gives the majority of teams something to play for. (hell... you could have 4 separate divisions if you really want to keep everyone happy .)

I only throw this extremely elaborate idea out there, mainly because I'm bored and have nothing better to do, but also as there seems to be a lot of contention as to who would make up each division if the SFL were to go in such a way. I feel this format would alleviate the issues discussed on here regarding the make up of each division ie: junior participation and that means any team could find themselves in either division at the pointy end of the season... and regarding tanking, who wants to win a div 2 flag, when you know you had a chance to win a div 1 flag through out the year (could possibly minimize any financial benefit the league may award for winning the div 2 title)

[Turbo]

secondstring wrote:
Rumor has it that a high up figure amongst the Cove hierachy was overheard saying that if Cove don't start winning some games the coach will be getting the flick...

Turbo wrote
3 games in. Nice try.

2nd string or is it 7th string coming from the div 7 saafl.. You seem to know something the rest of us don't. If you have it show it or are you just stirring the pot??. Where was this so called conversation? .

My source overheard it under the verandah. Seems the club been going backwards since the historic agm last year.

I call BS. I agree Vics. Second string Pm who and when this was said and we can talk. If not you'll be considered nothing but a troll.

Thought so. Troll it is.

On a different note it was great to see Aldinga get a win on the weekend. Some reward for those few behind the scenes who have put in a huge effort for a number of years

[afc9798]

Admittedly I am only new to the league, however talk of forming a new league, ala ICL/USFL/Super League/Clive Palmer's Football League, makes me ponder some other 'out there' approaches that could benefit junior and senior footy in the SFL.

Firstly, the junior league would become a separate entity from the senior comp, although still tied in under the SFL moniker. This would allow you to program junior matches as normal with the aim being, pending actual participating sides, that matches are to be played before senior games still. This meaning junior footy would ultimately be decided by a board focused on junior footy but still aligned to their senior SFL club. Basically it would be a similar scenario as you find with Metro Junior Leagues, but still operated by the SFL but in our own unique way.

Now for the big boys, and this is where it gets interesting...

To steal a format from completely left field, Football in Brazil used to run two leagues within their season, an altura(sic?) and clasura(sic?) championship. What would basically happen is that each side would play each other once, then at the completion of the first round, be split in half, with the top half playing for the premiership, and the bottom half playing for a div 2 title essentially. Teams would carry over their previous points against the teams they now have in their respective 'new league' (as they do in super 6 stage at cricket world cups) and a new draw to be made, the determination of how many games to be played is not overly critical, but obviously you still have a final 4 or 5 series to determine each divisions premiership winner, which still gives the majority of teams something to play for. (hell... you could have 4 separate divisions if you really want to keep everyone happy .)

I only throw this extremely elaborate idea out there, mainly because I'm bored and have nothing better to do, but also as there seems to be a lot of contention as to who would make up each division if the SFL were to go in such a way. I feel this format would alleviate the issues discussed on here regarding the make up of each division ie: junior participation and that means any team could find themselves in either division at the pointy end of the season... and regarding tanking, who wants to win a div 2 flag, when you know you had a chance to win a div 1 flag through out the year (could possibly minimize any financial benefit the league may award for winning the div 2 title)

Some good thoughts there. I especially like the 2 comp model for seniors. I'm not convinced we need a separate board for the junior comp, but I am convinced it needs better representation at SFL level. Too many levels of bureaucracy always results in more complexity and the potential of splits in the ranks. What is needed is a nimble, focused and well represented board with a strong dose of new thinking from some younger blood. I appreciate totally the difficulties of administrating football for a number of clubs and in no way am I denegrating those that volunteer their time for the competition, but sometimes new blood is needed to keep the ideas flowing.

[Oldman Munga]

Admittedly I am only new to the league, however talk of forming a new league, ala ICL/USFL/Super League/Clive Palmer's Football League, makes me ponder some other 'out there' approaches that could benefit junior and senior footy in the SFL.

Firstly, the junior league would become a separate entity from the senior comp, although still tied in under the SFL moniker. This would allow you to program junior matches as normal with the aim being, pending actual participating sides, that matches are to be played before senior games still. This meaning junior footy would ultimately be decided by a board focused on junior footy but still aligned to their senior SFL club. Basically it would be a similar scenario as you find with Metro Junior Leagues, but still operated by the SFL but in our own unique way.

Now for the big boys, and this is where it gets interesting...

To steal a format from completely left field, Football in Brazil used to run two leagues within their season, an altura(sic?) and clasura(sic?) championship. What would basically happen is that each side would play each other once, then at the completion of the first round, be split in half, with the top half playing for the premiership, and the bottom half playing for a div 2 title essentially. Teams would carry over their previous points against the teams they now have in their respective 'new league' (as they do in super 6 stage at cricket world cups) and a new draw to be made, the determination of how many games to be played is not overly critical, but obviously you still have a final 4 or 5 series to determine each divisions premiership winner, which still gives the majority of teams something to play for. (hell... you could have 4 separate divisions if you really want to keep everyone happy .)

I only throw this extremely elaborate idea out there, mainly because I'm bored and have nothing better to do, but also as there seems to be a lot of contention as to who would make up each division if the SFL were to go in such a way. I feel this format would alleviate the issues discussed on here regarding the make up of each division ie: junior participation and that means any team could find themselves in either division at the pointy end of the season... and regarding tanking, who wants to win a div 2 flag, when you know you had a chance to win a div 1 flag through out the year (could possibly minimize any financial benefit the league may award for winning the div 2 title)

Some good thoughts there. I especially like the 2 comp model for seniors. I'm not convinced we need a separate board for the junior comp, but I am convinced it needs better representation at SFL level. Too many levels of bureaucracy always results in more complexity and the potential of splits in the ranks. What is needed is a nimble, focused and well represented board with a strong dose of new thinking from some younger blood. I appreciate totally the difficulties of administrating football for a number of clubs and in no way am I denegrating those that volunteer their time for the competition, but sometimes new blood is needed to keep the ideas flowing.

All this talk of forming another League is nothin but B/S , would love to see the first club with the BALLS TO TRY IT .
The League is currently in talks with 5 HFL Clubs and has had enquiries from 1 GSFL Club regarding joining the SFL from 2014 onwards , now should these clubs come on board it is inevatable that we go to 2 divisions from 2014 onwards .
How it is decided who goes to what Div should be dictated by ladder positions over a number of yrs (ie average over the last 3) with Elevation and Relegation decided by standings at the completion of each seasons finals series, having said that I dont believe a Div 2 premiership side should be automatically elevated purely because they won a premiership , the club in question must want to be elevated as they may wish to strengthen stocks for another yr before going to Div 1 , just my thoughts on the subject , Cya @ The Footy

[Down the Hill]

Good to see a well considered comment from you OM. Alot of the talk of having 2 Divisions is based around what happens in Amateur League and also some of the Victorian Metro Leagues that have more than 1 Division. However the one big difference with that comparison is juniors.

Relegation and Promotion and the strength of the comp the seniors play in has no impact on juniors in those leagues. The junior comps are completely separate and normally played on a Sunday. And even though you may think otherwise, Brighton are still an advocate for Saturday junior footy in the SFL as the principal junior comps.

We have 4 clubs that no-one would deny are currently Division 2 clubs in seniors and juniors and all 4 would benefit playing more regularly against each other in a separate Division, senior and juniors, at least for now. But beyond those 4 it becomes very grey. Should the next 3 or 4 "weakest" senior teams based on whatever model ones uses in making that assessment deserve to have their juniors playing in a lower division. If Flaggies were in that bracket, their juniors would absolutely dominate. Many of them with aspirations of playing at a higher level would know that playing Division 1 is better for their prospects and look to move clubs or even leagues if SFL rules made it difficult to switch to another SFL club.

Division 2 was already suffering that fate before the move to a single Division. 2 Divisions seemed to work best when the 2nd Division was called the Rural League and consisted mostly of what were then considered country towns.

I just can't see 2 Divisions happening with 15 clubs unless the SFL and clubs bit the bullet and continued to run the Juniors as one competiton and give Mark the difficult task of giving clubs as many home games as possible where all Saturday teams played together. And we know that some clubs would be livid at any regular separation.

If more clubs came into the SFL then maybe more of a chance to run a full 2 Divisions but the issue of a clubs senior and junior strength for those on the fringes of the 2 Divisions will always be an issue in running that model for seniors and juniors. I know Hills do it (with some difficulty and some weird and wonderful points sytem on assessimg clubs) but the rural nature of that league means town and club loyalty probably runs deeper than the SFL.

[Numbers]

OM a new league might be a pipe dream but it would be a cracking comp with a full day of club vs club footy!

The other 5 clubs could either play in the amateurs where they can get away with not having juniors play before them or fold! If they folded it would improve the quality & add extra kids to the stocks of the remaining 10 clubs! The southern area isn't big enough (participation rates, $$$$, etc) for more than 10-12 quality clubs!

2 divisions will work ok for the seniors but would mean the juniors would suffer & the beauty of the SFL is a whole day at the footy!

In the 10 team GSFL there is not one club that doesn't have all four sides (A's, B's, SColts & JColts)!

The SFL isn't the AFL, it doesn't need 15 plus teams it needs 10 good Clubs!

[liverpool kiss]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

[vics01]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

LK where do I get what you are on?? It must be good stuff

[Turbo]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

I'd be interested in your rationale for this

[Numbers]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

I'd be interested in your rationale for this

I reckon LK has 8 or 9/10 clubs right. Get rid of Marion & get Flaggies in! Also if Edwardstown can get Saturday 14's & 16's next year get them in for MVPark!

[liverpool kiss]

when I started, there was no flaggies, no edwardstown, no aldinga, no lonsdale or o,sullies, hackham were the same 15 yrs ago.

[Straight Line]

when I started, there was no flaggies, no edwardstown, no aldinga, no lonsdale or o,sullies, hackham were the same 15 yrs ago.

Great grounds for getting rid of clubs Hawks the same 15 years ago (1998)

[Look Good In Leather]

when I started, there was no flaggies, no edwardstown, no aldinga, no lonsdale or o,sullies, hackham were the same 15 yrs ago.

Great grounds for getting rid of clubs Hawks the same 15 years ago (1998)

Flagstaff Hill & Hackham were both Division 1 clubs in 1998

[Oldman Munga]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

Morphettville Pk and Marion dont provide 5 Sat Sides , Blackwood who will join in 2014 and Flagstaff Hill do so for mine if its going to be a 10 team Div 1 nxt yr , I would put them in before some 1/2 Club , absolutely imperative that Div 1 sides can provide a full day ( ie , 14's through to A Grade ) of club footy , let the rest of the rabble battle it out in Div 2

[Esteban Vihaio]

we dont need any extra clubs, our league is our own and we need to keep it that way. 10 clubs, all with juniors and if you aren't cutting the mustard and and are holding the league down, then cut em and fill remaining sides or go to the amatuer league. What I would like to see...
SFL 2014 Teams
Mvp
Marion
Brighton
Cove
Happy valley
Reynella
Mvale
Christies
Pt noarlunga
Noarlunga

Morphettville Pk and Marion dont provide 5 Sat Sides , Blackwood who will join in 2014 and Flagstaff Hill do so for mine if its going to be a 10 team Div 1 nxt yr , I would put them in before some 1/2 Club , absolutely imperative that Div 1 sides can provide a full day ( ie , 14's through to A Grade ) of club footy , let the rest of the rabble battle it out in Div 2

Porties did not have five saturday sides last year. Boot them too by that logic.

In the ten team comp that was succesful pre 2001, there were a number of clubs who did not have u/17 and u/18 sides

[The Angry Bull]

my only concern with the 'its imperative that you fill 5 sides if you are to be in div 1' theory is that, it depends what you actually want the aim of the league to be. do you want div 1 to be the best 10 a grade sides? providing a higher standard of footy. or do you want the ten teams who can fill all 5 saturday sides?. div 1 should contain the 10 best performing teams, if its over the last couple of years positions, so be it. Those teams will develop over time, that's what happens when you play in a 'higher league'. the juniors are already scheduled so games are played at alternate venues when required. does this magical power stop if we were to allow someone like mvp in div 1?

[liverpool kiss]

my only concern with the 'its imperative that you fill 5 sides if you are to be in div 1' theory is that, it depends what you actually want the aim of the league to be. do you want div 1 to be the best 10 a grade sides? providing a higher standard of footy. or do you want the ten teams who can fill all 5 saturday sides?. div 1 should contain the 10 best performing teams, if its over the last couple of years positions, so be it. Those teams will develop over time, that's what happens when you play in a 'higher league'. the juniors are already scheduled so games are played at alternate venues when required. does this magical power stop if we were to allow someone like mvp in div 1?

I would hate to be the one who is making the decision.
it's such a tough call and that's why they have not made one either way.
are we confident 2014 will bring in a change. I hope it will, doesn't worry me which way they go, so long ad we aren't playing 4-5 dead rubbers every year. out league could be so much better, we are all missing out...

[Backliner]

I don't have the time to crunch numbers but from a general look it appears the floggings aren't as bad as previous years (I know Aldinga have M'Parks this week touch wood) but is it possible the points system is working, slowly? Aldinga did retain a fair few players as I'm sure Hackham and OSB did, Happy Valley may be the standout, just putting it out there that maybe things aren't as bad as they have been.

One downside of having the results in straight after games is the young lads check online who's in the best players so when we do presentations from 6.30pm it's no surprise anymore, that's technology though. I used to like not knowing who got in the best players, now they can see before the coach reads them out.