Teachers pay dispute

[Dutchy]

How did teachers get to parliment house today at 4pm if they are suppose to be working?

According to the AEU website, 4pm is out of normal school hours.

[The Yetti]

How did teachers get to parliment house today at 4pm if they are suppose to be working?

According to the AEU website, 4pm is out of normal school hours.

I thought teachers were marking, planning for next week, doing student interviews, after hours school activities, etc etc

[smac]

Teachers should, as should all Public servants spend some time in the Private Sector.

Whether it be in the Cooperate sector or a Privately owned business.

see what it is like to have to sit one on one for a pay rise
See what it is like to have to attain KPI's
hAVE ANY TEACHERS HAD TO SACK SOMEONE,
WILL YOU BE RETRENCHED IN THE NEXT YEAR OR SO
HOW MANY TEACHERS COACH THE SCHOOL FOOTY SIDE NOW DAYS
IN THE PANTHER LEAGUE I KNOW OF 2

See what it is like to only have 4 weeks leave

Oh yes and be at work from 7am till 7pm and then do work at home

OH YES I ATTENDED A.C.A.E IN THE EARLY 70'S

WE HAVE ALL GOT WORK PROBLEMS, TEACHERS DO HAVE IT EASIER THAN MOST

Good point about the footy sides. I know for a fact that there are 2 teachers actively involved in school cricket in the entire Northern Zone, from Mawson Lakes to Gawler.

[RustyCage]

Teachers should, as should all Public servants spend some time in the Private Sector.

Whether it be in the Cooperate sector or a Privately owned business.

see what it is like to have to sit one on one for a pay rise
See what it is like to have to attain KPI's
hAVE ANY TEACHERS HAD TO SACK SOMEONE,
WILL YOU BE RETRENCHED IN THE NEXT YEAR OR SO
HOW MANY TEACHERS COACH THE SCHOOL FOOTY SIDE NOW DAYS
IN THE PANTHER LEAGUE I KNOW OF 2

See what it is like to only have 4 weeks leave

Oh yes and be at work from 7am till 7pm and then do work at home

OH YES I ATTENDED A.C.A.E IN THE EARLY 70'S

WE HAVE ALL GOT WORK PROBLEMS, TEACHERS DO HAVE IT EASIER THAN MOST

Good point about the footy sides. I know for a fact that there are 2 teachers actively involved in school cricket in the entire Northern Zone, from Mawson Lakes to Gawler.

There are two teachers in the school i work in who are actively involved in school cricket - AN and AC.

[RustyCage]

Ok, theres only so much of this demeaning crap I can read by people who know jack about the real world of teaching, even though some of them pretend to.

Here is my WTF file - comments that made me shake my head. I'm not going to mention who posted them.

- why not have the whole day off? shows they aint real serious "lets go on strike, on hang on we lose pay, lets make it a half day" (Shows no understanding of the issue at all )

- How about those teachers who are prepared to undergo retraining to teach areas of need (maths, science) get rewarded with a few extra clams in their bucket, while those teachers who demand 21% for singing songs to six year olds get nothing? (We do this training every year already, and I wont even comment on he singing songs to 6 year olds part)

- All professionals need to have their performace evaulated why should teachers be any different especially when others at teh same levels in the public service (AS0 3-4s/P1s 0 (entry level teachers) to ASO 5-7s/P2-3s (senior teachers)) have to under go it. (We do this, every teacher does, regardless of experience)

- Why shouldn't teachers be exposed to the same scruitiny that I was when dealing with adolescents who were developing skills? (The scruitiny of our performance would be the same at the very least)

- For anyone to suggest teachers should be exempt from any sort of annual performance review is not living in the real world (Anyone who thinks we aren't subject to yearly reviews is completely deluded)

- They (lawyers) are responsible for making decisions that affect peoples lives - victims and perpetrators - in ways that can never be changed. Wrong decision - big problems. Bad day at work for a teacher? Unlikely in most cases to have a lifelong effect on one or more people. So make your choice - teacher for $75K or prosecutor for $75K? (I cant believe someone would even make this comparison! As a teacher, if we do our job well, there will be a lot less perpetrators in the first place)

- I'm just amazed by teachers who complain they have to look after a class of 30 kids as part of the argument.I mean, isn't that their job? Isn't that what they get paid for? What did they expect was going to happen? It's like a dentist complaining he has to put his hand inside other peoples' mouths.I have a brother and sister who are teachers and I get sick of hearing them complain. Don't like the job? Then find something else to do. (I dont even know where to begin on this one)

- I thought that the potential to be sued for making a stuff up is also a criterion. Hence most professionals have indemity insurance. Give the pay rise, but let parents sue for unsatisfactory performance. (What do you perceive as a poor performance?)

- The Union has got themselves and their members into a riled up, fantasy land and they have made promises to the members that can't deliver (This comment shows that the media had riled the ignorant public into a frenzy, and into a fantasy land where the actual cause of the industrial action seemingly vanishes. Do some research into the real issue.)

- [performance reviews] the answer is no they dont and the teachers believe they should be immune from this for some reason ( Did I just read that? This shows you know absolutely nothing about how teaching works, what an idiotic statement)

- Union comes out and says its more about the future of education in this state than the money, yet as per this thread its about the $$$$ (The people in this thread have shown time and time again that they know nothing about teaching, let alone this issue, so the thread focusing on pay is no surprise)

- bluff by the Union and another disservice (IMO) they are doing to their members in trying to convince everyone of this potential mass exodus of teachers. (The mass exodus isnt potentially going to happen, it HAS happened)

- This dispute is about union control and wages ( no, and no. If you sum up the dispute in these two ways, go and do some research into the real issue.)

- surely the Education Dept have people and strategies in place always looking at this? (You'd think so, but no. DECS are a government department, they side with the government, and are happy to ignore the needs of the teachers. Just looking at how teachers are employed proves this)

- Teachers who don't like the pay here should move (They did, and they need to be brought back to increase the standard of teaching. How are you going to do this? Pay them something at least reasonable close to to what they are getting interstate)

- still waiting for a decent arguemnet from the teaching profession on their professional development (its all been explained. The problem is that your definition of a decent argument is one that supports your incorrect view)

- then they get 12 weeks holiday. (no we dont. we have 12 weeks where the kids arent in the classroom, but that is only 1 part of our job)

- but individual teachers are currently unaccountable (we are? wow! )

- During my school life perhaps 25% of teachers were great or inspiring, 50% were adequate and 25% were hopeless (ummm, your views on your teachers as a student is meaningless to their actual ability and worth in a school. If you dont like a teacher you will find them inadequate, hopeless and uninspiring. If you like them, you will have the opposite opinion. This has nothing to do with their professional worth)

- our Prime Minister send his kids to a private school, does that say something? (it shows he has the money to afford to do it. That is all)

- If they did their lesson planning and the like at these times, they wouldn't need pupil free days and professional development days in term time. (We do our lesson planning on student free days? )

- I thought teachers were marking, planning for next week, doing student interviews, after hours school activities (Thats what we do. The teachers who go to the rally still do all these things after the rally)

[Dogwatcher]

Did I do something wrong? None of my contributions are in that post!

Interesting read.

[Psyber]

Over the last 15 years I have interviewed an written WorkCover reports about a significant number of teachers.

In most cases they have been conscientious people, positively motivated towards educating and guiding the students, and not so much bothered by their pay and hours, but by the fact that they have felt over-supervised, under-trusted, and devalued, by the Principals and even more by the bureaucrats above the Principals in the department. The theme of their frustration, as reported to me, has been the feeling that the requirements of form-filling and providing lesson plans, and reasons for varying lesson plans, and proving what they have done afterwards, have all detracted from their ability to spend adequate time teaching.

They have also complained that the Union representation has tended to ignore these issues in preference for pursuing pay and condition issues, which won't actually improve the capacity to feel they have been able to do their job well, and that their efforts are valued and appreciated by the department. In effect, the industrialisation of teaching has detracted from its value as a vocation.

My impression has been that most of these people have worked themselves harder and harder trying to do what they feel is a good job, while at the same time satisfying the internal bureaucracy, until they have run out of capacity to keep it up. In the end most left for jobs elsewhere, either in private schools, or moved out of teaching altogether.

[Pseudo]

... the real world of teaching ...

Best oxymoron I've seen in a long time.

[Dutchy]

PAFC, what reviews do teachers have of their performance? Monthly, Quarterly and what form and who from?

No one seems to be able to tell me

[jokerz]

When I was in school they never had a teachers strike, the same teachers were at the school for ten years or more, none of this two and three year contract crap,detention was writing 500 lines or 500 words that were 6 letters or more till your hands were sore from writing, the beach bat was the common arse wacker, these kids today think they got it bad and the same with the teachers, why should they get a pay rise more that what anyone else gets, come back to the real world.We have to justify our skills and show certificates why cant they.

[Dutchy]

So I presume cause this has gone quiet over the holidays and considering the current economic climate that they the teachers have backed down?

[Dogwatcher]

Pay dispute to be resolved today.
arbitration in Industrial Relations Commission - 3.30.

From what I understand, they will get 12 per cent.

Mike Rann has said "whatever the decision today, the Government will honour it".

[Hondo]

The Govt were offering between 11% (for most) and 14% (for some)? The Union wanted 21%. And the independent commision arrives at 12%. Mmmm ....

The Union must be praying the commission awards back pay entitlements

I know many employees that haven't had a pay rise for 18 months to 2 years out here in private enterprise

[Turbo]

The Govt were offering between 11% (for most) and 14% (for some)? The Union wanted 21%. And the independent commision arrives at 12%. Mmmm ....

The Union must be praying the commission awards back pay entitlements

I know many employees that haven't had a pay rise for 18 months to 2 years out here in private enterprise

It was all a waste of time. The union needs to get rid of Haythorpe

[Squawk]

LMAO

this topic is like Lazarus!