More Troops to the Middle East

[Iron Fist]

You mean Afghanistan.

Do you accept the above?

Send more troops.

No Peace Keepers with restrictions.

Thats BullSh*t.

Give me a gun. Send Dog_ger.

Or just Nuke the place.

Sorry Guys.

I can't believe posts like this are allowed on this site, let alone any public forum that is moderated.

You Dogger are a racist, hate filled soul, who seems to get off on winding people up and making ridiculous blanket statements out of either complete ignorance or bitterness.

Nuke the place? Good idea. Wipe out all the poor innocent souls - men, women and children, whose only crime is trying to live life in a war torn country where oppression is the only form of leadership they've experienced and desperate poverty is all they've ever known.

I'd rather have asylum seekers from Afghanistan living in our country than people with your disgraceful, racist attitude.

How you can just tar every citizen of a particular country with the same brush is beyond me. You need to get out and see what the world is really like.

Thats not fair

Some of the things dogger said may have been out of line
but to a point I agree with him.

Would you rather have more asylum seekers in our country?
so what in 20 years we have slums similar to other countries and gangs that run the street.
These people are ruthless (thats the way they are taught to be) and once allowed into our country with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia they will cause Havoc.
Look at the problems that have started with a tiny minority of sudanese and other african races. Stabings by 14yr olds.
Or the Middle east refugees, causing havoc in the city selling drugs and bashing people in packs.

These are the people you dont want living in our country!!

[shoe boy]

Dirty smelly war that has vested interests for the USA and its corporates!!!

[Johno6]

/me starts singing *Why can't we be friends?*

[Dirko]

What ever the views held, the question was about sending more Troops to the Middle East.

My view is no. It seems as the Middle East can't help themselves, let alone anyone trying to give them a hand.

Unfortunately if your in the defence force, you have peanuts sitting in a ivory tower making decisions on where to send you, and they're only thinking of themselves and the way it reflects back on their political party.

As for the fallen sappers & K9;

They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning,
We will remember them.

Lest we forget.

[MightyEagles]

Why are people so unkind?

[Q.]

Thats not fair

Some of the things dogger said may have been out of line
but to a point I agree with him.

Would you rather have more asylum seekers in our country?
so what in 20 years we have slums similar to other countries and gangs that run the street.
These people are ruthless (thats the way they are taught to be) and once allowed into our country with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia they will cause Havoc.
Look at the problems that have started with a tiny minority of sudanese and other african races. Stabings by 14yr olds.
Or the Middle east refugees, causing havoc in the city selling drugs and bashing people in packs.

These are the people you dont want living in our country!!

Sorry Fisty, but...

The reason they are fleeing their country and seeking asylum elsewhere is because we have have invaded it and made it as inhospitable as its ever been.

Secondly, "with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia" is a myth spread by grossly inaccurate emails.

Thirdly, violence and drug use among the youth is not limited to people of Middle-Eastern or African appearance - but who cares, because it makes for one hell of a media beat-up.

[Pseudo]

The war is waged by each ruling group against its own subjects, and the object of the war is not to make or prevent conquests of territory, but to keep the structure of society intact.

[devilsadvocate]

Sorry Fisty, but...

The reason they are fleeing their country and seeking asylum elsewhere is because we have have invaded it and made it as inhospitable as its ever been.

Secondly, "with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia" is a myth spread by grossly inaccurate emails.

Thirdly, violence and drug use among the youth is not limited to people of Middle-Eastern or African appearance - but who cares, because it makes for one hell of a media beat-up.

I'm glad there is some sanity on here.

I couldn't think a reply that wouldn't get me banned, but yours hits the nail square on the head.

Very well put there Quichey.

[Iron Fist]

Thats not fair

Some of the things dogger said may have been out of line
but to a point I agree with him.

Would you rather have more asylum seekers in our country?
so what in 20 years we have slums similar to other countries and gangs that run the street.
These people are ruthless (thats the way they are taught to be) and once allowed into our country with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia they will cause Havoc.
Look at the problems that have started with a tiny minority of sudanese and other african races. Stabings by 14yr olds.
Or the Middle east refugees, causing havoc in the city selling drugs and bashing people in packs.

These are the people you dont want living in our country!!

Sorry Fisty, but...

The reason they are fleeing their country and seeking asylum elsewhere is because we have have invaded it and made it as inhospitable as its ever been.

Secondly, "with more benefits that many of the retirees that have done so much for australia" is a myth spread by grossly inaccurate emails.

Thirdly, violence and drug use among the youth is not limited to people of Middle-Eastern or African appearance - but who cares, because it makes for one hell of a media beat-up.

there all good points

they are fleeing the country for that reason, but before we invaded was in all a happy place over there, they still had barbarian rules and killings still happened!

How are they grossly innacurate?
I have no info to prove im right and neither do you, or do you??
the people coming over get it pretty good, when we have australians that are homeless.

That is true about drug taking not being just them,
but they are violent and the way some behave is like they are still living in a third world country
with shootings and other such things, you wouldnt have seen nearly as much of that stuff 20yrs ago.

[devilsadvocate]

It seems as the Middle East can't help themselves, let alone anyone trying to give them a hand.

Just on that point, it's only our differing values to those help by people in the middle east that says they can't rule themselves.

I don't see how the people of Afghanistan or Iraq are happier under American dominance that they were under the oppresive regimes of the Taliban and Sadam Hussein. I don't see how human rights have improved. I don't see how their safety has improved. There is still famine, corruption and deep seeded cultural problems that are being exacerbated by the occupation in each country.

The current occupation is creating a generation in each country that will grow up resenting the west and will most likely actively look at ways of getting revenge.

Imagine how pissed we would all be if a huge army of say muslim crusaders invaded us, booted out our government (well perhaps that wouldn't be such a bad thing given what's going at present, but that's a whole other discussion), then implemented their own style of government because they decided that was better than what we had previously.

I can guarantee that we'd all be up in arms and doing everything in our power to bring them down too.

IMO - bring our troops home and let the poor souls in these countries try to work things out for themselves. If they ask for our help to rebuld their country, then by all means, lets help.

[Psyber]

I'd favour pulling out of Afghanistan and Iraq, and letting the middle east sort itself out. Then they can only blame each other.
We should have learned Afghanistan was a lost cause from watching the Russians try to control the situation.
There was a similar lesson about Vietnam that should have been obvious when the French gave up and bailed out, previous to the US going in.
Unfortunately, the US has a history of propping up dictators who seem to favour them at the time [as the USSR did too] only to find themselves in the resultant mess later.
Then they try to make it look better by dragging their "allies" in, too, to dress it up as international peacekeeping.

We shouldn't focus on only the USA and oil though - the whole point of the Russian invasion of Chechnya was control of natural gas sales to western Europe.

[Pseudo]

just as there was a lesson about Vietnam that should have been obvious when the French gave up and bailed out.

Yeah, but that was the French...

[Iron Fist]

It seems as the Middle East can't help themselves, let alone anyone trying to give them a hand.

Just on that point, it's only our differing values to those help by people in the middle east that says they can't rule themselves.

I don't see how the people of Afghanistan or Iraq are happier under American dominance that they were under the oppresive regimes of the Taliban and Sadam Hussein. I don't see how human rights have improved. I don't see how their safety has improved. There is still famine, corruption and deep seeded cultural problems that are being exacerbated by the occupation in each country.

The current occupation is creating a generation in each country that will grow up resenting the west and will most likely actively look at ways of getting revenge.

Imagine how pissed we would all be if a huge army of say muslim crusaders invaded us, booted out our government (well perhaps that wouldn't be such a bad thing given what's going at present, but that's a whole other discussion), then implemented their own style of government because they decided that was better than what we had previously.

I can guarantee that we'd all be up in arms and doing everything in our power to bring them down too.

IMO - bring our troops home and let the poor souls in these countries try to work things out for themselves. If they ask for our help to rebuld their country, then by all means, lets help.

I agree with what you say there

all i want is them not to come to Australia with these problems.
Let them sort them out in there own countries.
why should we put up with there crap??

with the help thing, they cant pick and choose what help they want and dont want.
well they can but the governments wont do anything if they could!

[Psyber]

just as there was a lesson about Vietnam that should have been obvious when the French gave up and bailed out.

Yeah, but that was the French...

Very pragmatic, and not into heroics about lost causes, the French - prepared to live to fight another day...

[Q.]

there all good points

they are fleeing the country for that reason, but before we invaded was in all a happy place over there, they still had barbarian rules and killings still happened!

They were stable countries and murder rates were no more than most democratised Western countries.

How are they grossly innacurate?
I have no info to prove im right and neither do you, or do you??
the people coming over get it pretty good, when we have australians that are homeless.

http://www.asrc.org.au/act_now/centrelink_myth.html

That is true about drug taking not being just them,
but they are violent and the way some behave is like they are still living in a third world country
with shootings and other such things, you wouldnt have seen nearly as much of that stuff 20yrs ago.

Hate and violence don't necessarily go hand in hand with poverty. It's like saying all us South Australian's are violent because a few people beat, stab and shoot each other occasionally on Hindley St.

[Dogwatcher]

I agree with what you say there

all i want is them not to come to Australia with these problems.
Let them sort them out in there own countries.
why should we put up with there crap??

I could imagine Bennelong standing at Sydney Cove and having a chat with his mates saying the exact same things back in 1788.

[devilsadvocate]

all i want is them not to come to Australia with these problems.
Let them sort them out in there own countries.
why should we put up with there crap??

We shouldn't put up with their crap, but as Quichey said, it's not just people that have immigrated to Aus from Afghanistan, the middle east or Africa that are causing problems on our streets. Us Aussies are pretty good at beating each other up, shooting each other and being generally anti-social.

But we can't blame them for wanting to come here, when we are contributing to a huge problem in their own country.

If I had my young family in a war torn, unsafe country, I'd be looking at my options to move to a safer country with better opportunites.

There are lots of brilliant stories of immigrants coming to Australia and contributing in a brilliantly positive way to our society. Unfortunately, main stream media loves to focus on the few negatives. Fear sells papers.

My final point - I bet the Aboriginal people wish that Europeans never came and brought all the problems we did. I bet they wish Europeans had stayed in our own country and sorted out our own problems. I bet they hate putting up with our crap.

Imagine the headlines of what happened in Australia 220 years ago if it happened today. A country taking thousands of it's prisoners to another country on the opposite side of the world and basically saying - here you go, your problem now!

[devilsadvocate]

I agree with what you say there

all i want is them not to come to Australia with these problems.
Let them sort them out in there own countries.
why should we put up with there crap??

I could imagine Bennelong standing at Sydney Cove and having a chat with his mates saying the exact same things back in 1788.

Beat me to it!

[devilsadvocate]

just as there was a lesson about Vietnam that should have been obvious when the French gave up and bailed out.

Yeah, but that was the French...

Very pragmatic, and not into heroics about lost causes, the French - prepared to live to fight another day...

Not in 1940 they weren't.

[Q.]

Fear sells papers.

Wins elections too