Port Rezoning

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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby am Bays » Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:56 pm

Booney wrote:Couple that with SANFL clubs spending less time in schools than they did in our day ( remember pie and pasty nights? ) and where your zone is will become less and less relevant to who supports you.


Disagree Booney, clubs do more in schools now then they did in "our" day based on the fact that between the SANFL and club DOs they hold more clinics as part of he PE lessons now over 3-4 weeks and in some schools through teh SANFl club athey have 10 week Auskick clinics compared to the old pie and pasty night.

Also needs to be stated that in my area we also get a lot of support from one AFL club as well. Whether that is planned in that Port have their SANFL clubs they help support and the Crows have their club zones they support, I don't know.

Always things clubs can do more to promote footy but it is light years ahead of what used to happen in the 80 and early 90s.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby tipper » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:06 pm

Booney wrote:It's a good story indeed, but our generation ( I'm assuming you're in your 30's ) might be about the last to experience that.

I grew up in Brooklyn Park, followed Port, my best mate from Lockleys was Glenelg, the third of our group was Norwood. All living in the Westies area.

With families more inclined to move for work and economic reasons ( where they can afford to buy / rent ) and kids likely to follow their Dad/Grand Dad's team the days of living in the area of the team you support is less likely to occur.

Couple that with SANFL clubs spending less time in schools than they did in our day ( remember pie and pasty nights? ) and where your zone is will become less and less relevant to who supports you.

I don't expect kids from North Haven to become Woodville-Port Adelaide-Le Fevre-North West Suburbs Eagles supporters over night.


hate to say it, but i agree with the Boonster..... (i feel so dirty ;))

i am mid thirties, and until i looked it up when we had a boy two years ago, i didnt even realise that i lived in Noth Adelaides Zone :shock:

i have spent the majority of my life living in "other" clubs zones, yet i am still a lifelong North supporter (even if i no longer attend games). luckily for me i was a shit footballer and never got the opportunity to be asked to wear the prison bars, nor was i tough enough to be a dog ;) we have only been in this suburb for the last 6 years or so since i got married, and the sanfl zone wasnt even considered when we were house shopping

i think Zones havent meant a lot for a while, and it is just a few people that remember the "good old days" that are clinging onto it. nothing wrong with remembering the past, but i dont think kids today really care who they are playing for, they are just striving for the best level they can. and no offence intended to those unhappy with these changes. not saying you are wrong at all (im actually jealous that you had that much of a connection to your clubs)

personal opinion but it is probably part of the general shift away from loyalty in the game as a whole. it seems that more players are moving between clubs more often, at all levels. it is rare to see an individual play hundreds of games with the one club. and it works both ways too, clubs are less loyal to the players than ever before (moreso at the highest levels), the game is now a business.

not saying any of that is a good or bad thing, it just is. this changing of the club boundaries, while a more dramatic change than ever before, has been happening for a while, and will continue to happen into the future. by the time my boy is old enough to be considered for high level footy we may very well be in a different clubs zone altogether (or more likely he will be shit like his old man), either way, if he plays for someone in the aflsa* competition in future, ill still go watch him, all the while wearing my North gear





*i dont believe that by the time this occurs there will be any memories of the sanfl, apart from us old fat bastards on the sidelines whingeing about how much better it used to be.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby bennymacca » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:09 pm

whufc wrote:U wouldn't expect an Predominatly AFL fan to understand though, heartlands and home grown are dying words in the AFL. A franchise can be picked up and moved at any stage.

No disrespect to u Benny but at a guess I'm going guess that your under the age of 23 and have just been saturated by the AFL from birth.


No disrespect but kindly get stuffed. I have been a centrals support for all of my 29 years. I would definitely describe myself as a crows supporter first and centrals second but that is neither here nor there.

I, for one, am a realist. I understand that there is significant changes, and through this thread I have learned more about the effects of those changes. But I am probably far more optimistic than most and decide to take changes in my stride rather than the conservative approach of it must be bad.

I also think there is a bigger picture. No matter what pure sanfl fans can do, the reality is they are not the biggest game in town. They will be forever slaves to the afl. As sucky as that might be it isn't going to change. May as well try and make lemonade.

Sure, there are things that can be improved. But putting the rose coloured glasses on and reminiscing of times gone by isn't going to change the present realities.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby bennymacca » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:13 pm

whufc wrote:
Booney wrote:
whufc wrote:U wouldn't expect an Predominatly AFL fan to understand though, heartlands and home grown are dying words in the AFL. A franchise can be picked up and moved at any stage.

No disrespect to u Benny but at a guess I'm going guess that your under the age of 23 and have just been saturated by the AFL from birth.


Why wouldn't you?

"...you're an idiot, but no disrespect..." :lol:


Because the AFL (especially the created franchises Adelaide, West Coast) isn't about heartland supporters, it's about capturing a wider audience

How many players on Adelaides list are from it's 'heartland', how many players/supporters even live its heartland of 'Adelaide'.

For me growing up I had no choice but to support Centrals, my family did, I lived in spitting distance of the ground, my school teacher was Richard Cochrane snr, who i also lived next door to and use to smash the cochrane brothers with my mates in backyard footy, and grew up at various stages having Matty Slade, Justin Casserly, Daniel Healy, Nathan Steinberner as our school teachers

We grew up at Wilbur Wilson house as our best mate was his son Adrian, Gilbert McAdam was the bar fly who use to come out and have a kick with us on Monday night at Eastern Park. And while we all played cdfa football against each other on weekends, we all came together to support the Dogs on Saturdays while dreaming we would wear the red, white and blue swearing we would never wear the black and white even if we got paid to.

These days the only time a Port Power player would venture into Port Adelaide would be for a promo photo shoot


You must be young if Nathan Steinberner is your teacher.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby daysofourlives » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:14 pm

bennymacca wrote:
areaman wrote:
bennymacca wrote:Seems fair enough. Good response by them I would have thought

I assume you are joking.


I wasn't actually.

I Meant that their position is clearly explained.

Whether or not the members agree is a completely different matter and one I can't comment on because I don't have a specific interest.


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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby whufc » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:18 pm

bennymacca wrote:
whufc wrote:
Booney wrote:
whufc wrote:U wouldn't expect an Predominatly AFL fan to understand though, heartlands and home grown are dying words in the AFL. A franchise can be picked up and moved at any stage.

No disrespect to u Benny but at a guess I'm going guess that your under the age of 23 and have just been saturated by the AFL from birth.


Why wouldn't you?

"...you're an idiot, but no disrespect..." :lol:


Because the AFL (especially the created franchises Adelaide, West Coast) isn't about heartland supporters, it's about capturing a wider audience

How many players on Adelaides list are from it's 'heartland', how many players/supporters even live its heartland of 'Adelaide'.

For me growing up I had no choice but to support Centrals, my family did, I lived in spitting distance of the ground, my school teacher was Richard Cochrane snr, who i also lived next door to and use to smash the cochrane brothers with my mates in backyard footy, and grew up at various stages having Matty Slade, Justin Casserly, Daniel Healy, Nathan Steinberner as our school teachers

We grew up at Wilbur Wilson house as our best mate was his son Adrian, Gilbert McAdam was the bar fly who use to come out and have a kick with us on Monday night at Eastern Park. And while we all played cdfa football against each other on weekends, we all came together to support the Dogs on Saturdays while dreaming we would wear the red, white and blue swearing we would never wear the black and white even if we got paid to.

These days the only time a Port Power player would venture into Port Adelaide would be for a promo photo shoot


You must be young if Nathan Steinberner is your teacher.


Yeah 31

Nathan Steinberner did a student placement at Craigmore High in 2000 with Matty Slade, was a great year to be in year 12.

Iirc Nathan was still on the Power list and was one the first full time afl players to be given outside study with an eye to the future life after footy
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby areaman » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:24 pm

bennymacca wrote:No disrespect but kindly get stuffed. I have been a centrals support for all of my 29 years. I would definitely describe myself as a crows supporter first and centrals second but that is neither here nor there.

I, for one, am a realist. I understand that there is significant changes, and through this thread I have learned more about the effects of those changes. But I am probably far more optimistic than most and decide to take changes in my stride rather than the conservative approach of it must be bad.

I also think there is a bigger picture. No matter what pure sanfl fans can do, the reality is they are not the biggest game in town. They will be forever slaves to the afl. As sucky as that might be it isn't going to change. May as well try and make lemonade.

Sure, there are things that can be improved. But putting the rose coloured glasses on and reminiscing of times gone by isn't going to change the present realities.

I'm not concerned about the AFL being bigger than the SANFL. Accepted that long ago and more than comfortable with it.

In fact for 23 years I was quite content to follow the Crows in the AFL and Eagles in the SANFL. My club merged in 1990 and I got over that, moved on and embraced the new Eagles.

My issue is the SANFL has tried to market itself as grassroots football. The last few years it's marketing slogan was something like Your Tribe Is Calling. I quite liked that. But it makes it kind of hard to associate with a "tribe" when you have such a large change in zones and move away from your heartland.

These current zone changes aren't just a bit of tinkering at the edges - for some clubs they are massive changes. And after the crap of the reserves situation this year this zone change is almost the final straw for me. We all have a tipping point and this last one is pretty much mine.

And if a zone and having a heartland isn't important why was it one of the alleged 5 principles of the SANFL when doing this redistribution?
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Dogwatcher » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:28 pm

bennymacca wrote: No disrespect but kindly get stuffed. I have been a centrals support for all of my 29 years. I would definitely describe myself as a crows supporter first and centrals second but that is neither here nor there.


Well, it is actually important, as your philosophy on football issues will be decided by your club priorities, whether you like it, or not.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby bennymacca » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:28 pm

Yeah that's a pretty fair point. As I said I can't really comment on the zones specifically as I'm not an eagles supporter and didn't really even know the original zones. If the Barossa was taken off centrals I think I would be annoyed too.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby bennymacca » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:31 pm

Dogwatcher wrote:
bennymacca wrote: No disrespect but kindly get stuffed. I have been a centrals support for all of my 29 years. I would definitely describe myself as a crows supporter first and centrals second but that is neither here nor there.


Well, it is actually important, as your philosophy on football issues will be decided by your club priorities, whether you like it, or not.


Yeah fair, I'll pay that. Probably allows me to give a view on what could actually be the majority of sanfl supporters in some cases - follow the sanfl as a secondary comp

Not saying that your opinions are less valid, they are probably more valid, but you have to admit your priorities probably cloud the bigger picture somewhat too sometimes.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby LPH » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:54 pm

Booney wrote: I grew up in Brooklyn Park, followed Port, my best mate from Lockleys was Glenelg, the third of our group was Norwood. All living in the Westies area.
With families more inclined to move for work and economic reasons ( where they can afford to buy / rent ) and kids likely to follow their Dad/Grand Dad's team the days of living in the area of the team you support is less likely to occur.
Couple that with SANFL clubs spending less time in schools than they did in our day ( remember pie and pasty nights? ) and where your zone is will become less and less relevant to who supports you.
I don't expect kids from North Haven to become Woodville-Port Adelaide-Le Fevre-North West Suburbs Eagles supporters over night.


Zoning is NOT about supporters, it's about PLAYERS!

The point is that traditional Zones (like what I & Aerie are talking about - in the Western Suburbs, where 'we' as kids & the next lot of kids, were zoned to West Torrens... WEST of the TORRENS River, from Hindmarsh to friggin' West Beach!).
So as these Zones have now disappeared, may as well remove West Torrens from the name - like the WTFC, it ceases to exist.
Woodville Oval, Woodville Areas (plus Port Areas) ... Call them the Woodville-Port Natives because there is ZERO West Torrens left!
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby spell_check » Tue Aug 05, 2014 7:28 pm

I don't know if you know this or not, but the Google Earth overlay has an option where you can bring up all of the names of the primary and secondary schools where they are. Who'd have thought my primary school would one day be in the Eagles zone!

I not keen on the zones anyway myself, for all of the reasons brought up in this thread, however I'm not so sure what could be done. Other than to go back to early last year with all the knowledge of this year to make the decisions for the future.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby spell_check » Tue Aug 05, 2014 7:56 pm

I'm fully aware of the fact that it is residential, not school based zoning, however if you can imagine the areas these schools are in, plus the new ground needed and old lost to promote the club, this is a graphic illustration of how much change to the zone it is:

Lost:
to Glenelg:
Grange Primary School
St Michaels College
Fulham Gardens Primary School
Star of the Sea Primary School
Henley High School
Fulham North Primary School
Henley Beach Primary School
St Francis Primary School
Kidman Park Primary School

to West:
Nazareth Catholic College
Flinders Park Primary School
Underdale High School
Lockleys North Primary School
St Joseph's School @ West Hindmarsh
Allenby Gardens Primary School
Islamic College of South Australia
Kilkenny Primary School
Adelaide Secondary School of English
School of Languages
St Margaret Marys School
Immaculate Heart of Mary School
Brompton Primary School
Bowden-Brompton Community School
Challa Gardens Primary School
Woodville Gardens B-7 School
St Patrick's Primary School
Regency Park School
St Bridgid's Primary School

Gain from Port:
North Haven Schools
Ocean View B-12 College
Adelaide West Special School
Our Lady of the Visitation Primary School
Largs Bay Primary School
Largs Bay Junior Primary School
Dominican Primary School
Le Fevre Peninsula Primary School
Le Fevre High School
Portside Christian School
Westport Primary School
Alberton Primary School
Mt Carmel College
Our Lady of Mt Carmel Primary School
St Joseph's Primary @ Ottoway
Roma Mitchell Secondary School
Pooraka Primary School
Karrendi Primary School
Parafield Gardens R-7 School
Parafield Gardens High School
Thomas More College
Holy Family Primary School
The Pines Junior/Primary School
Salisbury Downs Primary School
Riverdale Primary School
Bethany Christian School
Temple Christian College
Settlers Farm Campus
Burton Primary School


One factor which I don't think has been covered before is the distance the last schools on the list are to the club. I know it's the same currently for Norwood and Golden Grove/Surrey Downs area; no other club has its farthest part of its metro zone away from its ground.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Mickyj » Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:09 pm

Mr Beefy wrote:They should move their base to Alberton, be a bit more central than Woodville.


I think you mean return to Alberton the original Port Natives/West Torrens with 3 other teams played home games at Alberton !! And I'm not happy with losing the Eagles heartland . But I'm more than happy to bring in all those magpie juniors to the Eagles ranks! Who would have thought the 21 years I was forced by marriage to live on that side of the Port River in Taperoo I was actually in Eagle territory lmfao what a joke
I'm learning new stuff from this topic Cowandilla primary school was in Eagles territory thats funny . As i live next to richmond oval that school is within walking distance of richmond another lmfao moment

And someone said port companies wouldnt spend their money with the Eagles funny maughanthiem sponsor both clubs baa moo oink provide meat for both BBQ's as far as I know!

Still its a joke
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Mickyj » Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:10 pm

Mr Beefy wrote:They should move their base to Alberton, be a bit more central than Woodville.


I think you mean return to Alberton the original Port Natives/West Torrens with 3 other teams played home games at Alberton !! And I'm not happy with losing the Eagles heartland . But I'm more than happy to bring in all those magpie juniors to the Eagles ranks! Who would have thought the 21 years I was forced by marriage to live on that side of the Port River in Taperoo I was actually in Eagle territory lmfao what a joke
I'm learning new stuff from this topic Cowandilla primary school was in Eagles territory thats funny . As i live next to richmond oval that school is within walking distance of richmond another lmfao moment

And someone said port companies wouldnt spend their money with the Eagles funny maughanthiem sponsor both clubs baa moo oink provide meat for both BBQ's as far as I know!

Still its a joke
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Mickyj » Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:14 pm

spell_check wrote:I'm fully aware of the fact that it is residential, not school based zoning, however if you can imagine the areas these schools are in, plus the new ground needed and old lost to promote the club, this is a graphic illustration of how much change to the zone it is:

Lost:
to Glenelg:
Grange Primary School
St Michaels College
Fulham Gardens Primary School
Star of the Sea Primary School
Henley High School
Fulham North Primary School
Henley Beach Primary School
St Francis Primary School
Kidman Park Primary School

to West:
Nazareth Catholic College
Flinders Park Primary School
Underdale High School
Lockleys North Primary School
St Joseph's School @ West Hindmarsh
Allenby Gardens Primary School
Islamic College of South Australia
Kilkenny Primary School
Adelaide Secondary School of English
School of Languages
St Margaret Marys School
Immaculate Heart of Mary School
Brompton Primary School
Bowden-Brompton Community School
Challa Gardens Primary School
Woodville Gardens B-7 School
St Patrick's Primary School
Regency Park School
St Bridgid's Primary School

Gain from Port:
North Haven Schools
Ocean View B-12 College
Adelaide West Special School
Our Lady of the Visitation Primary School
Largs Bay Primary School
Largs Bay Junior Primary School
Dominican Primary School
Le Fevre Peninsula Primary School
Le Fevre High School
Portside Christian School
Westport Primary School
Alberton Primary School
Mt Carmel College
Our Lady of Mt Carmel Primary School
St Joseph's Primary @ Ottoway
Roma Mitchell Secondary School
Pooraka Primary School
Karrendi Primary School
Parafield Gardens R-7 School
Parafield Gardens High School
Thomas More College
Holy Family Primary School
The Pines Junior/Primary School
Salisbury Downs Primary School
Riverdale Primary School
Bethany Christian School
Temple Christian College
Settlers Farm Campus
Burton Primary School


One factor which I don't think has been covered before is the distance the last schools on the list are to the club. I know it's the same currently for Norwood and Golden Grove/Surrey Downs area; no other club has its farthest part of its metro zone away from its ground.



We now get Settlers farm that closer to Centrals
And I went to underdale when i went half or more the kids were in Wests zone , i understand that was decades ago lol
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Reddeer » Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:22 pm

Just adds up to pitiful decision by the SANFL. Certainly are going out of their way to destroy any semblance of a fair competition
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby robranisgod » Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:11 pm

One of the final nails in West Torrens Football Clubs coffin was taking most of their traditional area away from them and giving them the Tea Tree Gully area. Sure they got Bruce Lindsay from there, but so many top footballers from that area went to closer clubs. I know for a fact that the Jarman brothers were tied to Torrens as was North premiership player, Roger Carlaw. Port premiership player Ben Harris was also tied to Torrens and I have heard of a number of other Norwood, North, Port and Central players who were tied to Torrens but preferred to play closer to home. Johnny Graham went onto the radio pleading for the league to do something in that regard, but they had the rule in place that juniors could change clubs for $2000. Wealthy clubs like Norwood had a field day and my own club didn't do too badly either.
With these new boundaries, I can see something similar happening.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby Dogwatcher » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:17 am

bennymacca wrote: Not saying that your opinions are less valid, they are probably more valid, but you have to admit your priorities probably cloud the bigger picture somewhat too sometimes.


I have no doubt they are.
My SANFL club is my priority, followed by my AFL club.
So why would I want further AFL intrusion in a competition that has already taken a back seat for the "bigger picture".
People say we're living in the past, that's not the case. We understand the SANFL's position - all those of us against this move want is to ensure our competition doesn't take a further slide into oblivion than it already has thanks to AFL expansion (Adelaide's entry, Port's entry, rookie listings which take more players from our comp, expansion clubs further removing players from the comp and now...AFL reserves removing more players from our clubs)?
The AFL is the premier competition, I have no complaints about that, it clearly is.
The SANFL is between a very large rock and a place that is growing ever harder.
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Re: Port Rezoning

Postby bennymacca » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:25 am

Dogwatcher wrote:The SANFL is between a very large rock and a place that is growing ever harder.


Good post. And I agree with this.

But my point is that these realities are inescapable, and hiding behind said rock does nobody any favours.
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