The South Australian Political Landscape

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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby morell » Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:59 pm

tipper wrote:
morell wrote:The only thing you've proven is your ineptitude. Go back and have a read. Or look at Jimmy's map if you like.

There are no houses within living distance of the Adelaide CBD for less than 3.3x the average income.

That was not the case when Psyber bought his house.

You can try and argue where metro begins and ends if you like, but again, you're completely missing the point.


so elizabeth isnt within living distance of the cbd? or it isnt it metro? im confused, which is it? or is it just that you are too good for those areas?

anyway, the people i work with in the cbd and some of whom live as far out as willaston or lobethal will disagree. they commute here every day. elizabeth is closer than both of those, and there are several houses for the advertised price you are quoting available there.

just because it might be a little too far for you to ride your scooter in, doesnt mean it isnt metro, nor does it mean it isnt within living distance. try the search again, and dont limit it to postcode 5000. see what you get returned.
Again, you're seemingly arguing the same points I am.

Yes, people have to now buy a house in Elizabeth or Lobethal and commute for an hour if they want something affordable. Previously they didn't!!. And this urban sprawl has been exacerbated by planning policy, which is why I bolded that bit of my previous post.

How is this even an argument?! You keep supporting my logic.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby morell » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:00 pm

Jimmy_041 wrote:Yep, but think of all that time you can spend on your phone
AND they have built a new extension of the O Bahn for you
Ahhh sarcasm, The lowest form of wit.

I'll accept that as your admission that I am right. :D
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby tipper » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:14 pm

morell wrote:There are no houses within living distance of the Adelaide CBD for less than 3.3x the average income. 180k.


ok. try this. Yes there are.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby morell » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:22 pm

tipper wrote:
morell wrote:There are no houses within living distance of the Adelaide CBD for less than 3.3x the average income. 180k.


ok. try this. Yes there are.

No, there arent, when you're thinking within the context of Pysber's generation. Which was the entire premise of my original post. People now have to travel much further to get something even remotely close to what Psyber paid at a time where I doubt many of the places where you can buy land for 180k even existed

That a sacrifice that is required of this generation.

The difference I think we have is you think that's fair and reasonable.

I dont. Especially in SA where new developments in great areas which could make that sacrifice obsolete are hampered or squashed by state planners to protect the value of the property market.

So the ones with existing property get richer and richer, the ones that don't either miss out or have to make huge lifestyle sacrifices.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Trader » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:46 pm

morell wrote:Average income in 1990 - $24k
Average house price in 1990 - $100k
Average income in 2017 - $55k
Average house price in 2017 - $480k
1990 loan of 17% over 30 years will cost you - $513,243.12
2017 loan of 5% over 30 years will cost you - $888,976.61


Average income in 2017 is not 55k, it's $75,275 for South Australia.
You're not even close.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf ... num=&view=

As for what you pay over the life of the loan, you do realize that they end up with different assets. The 1990s purchaser ends up spending 513k and owns an average house, which you say is worth 480k. Any shock that those numbers are very similar?

Of course the 2017 guy pays more, and at the end of the life of the term, his 480k house is now worth 870k (2% inflation for 30 years), which is very similar to the 888k he's paid.

The cost of the house in different years $$$ is irrelevant.
You need to look at the purchasing power between the two groups.

Or explaining it another way, you've compared 513k in 1990 dollars to 888k in 2017 dollars. It's not the same thing.

Or a third way, based on the figures you've used.
The 1990 guy spends 21 times his average income (513/24) to acquire his home.
The 2017 guy spends 16 times his average income (888/55k) to acquire his home - and we know that 55 is actually 75, so its only 11 times.

Simply put, in 1990, you needed to devote 56% of the average wage to own an average house.
In 2017, you only need to stump up 39%.
Last edited by Trader on Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby tipper » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:52 pm

morell wrote:No, there arent, when you're thinking within the context of Pysber's generation. Which was the entire premise of my original post. People now have to travel much further to get something even remotely close to what Psyber paid at a time where I doubt many of the places where you can buy land for 180k even existed

That a sacrifice that is required of this generation.

The difference I think we have is you think that's fair and reasonable.

I dont. Especially in SA where new developments in great areas which could make that sacrifice obsolete are hampered or squashed by state planners to protect the value of the property market.

So the ones with existing property get richer and richer, the ones that don't either miss out or have to make huge lifestyle sacrifices.


huge sacrifices? like what my parents did 30 years ago? they moved to the exact sort of area we are talking about. why is this generation any different to them? or why are they any different to what i have had to do? all comes down to what your standards are. id suggest that many have unrealistic expectations.

when the missus and i initially got married and were looking for a house, she wanted to live in campbelltown or somewhere around there. guess what, nothing we could afford. what did we do? whinge about it? nope. we looked into areas that we could afford to live, and moved there. not sure why the next generation coming through shouldnt do the same really.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby amber_fluid » Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:56 pm

I clicked in here by mistake....... but it’s good to see Morrell spreads his BS evenly across the entire forum. :lol:
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:00 pm

tipper wrote:
morell wrote:No, there arent, when you're thinking within the context of Pysber's generation. Which was the entire premise of my original post. People now have to travel much further to get something even remotely close to what Psyber paid at a time where I doubt many of the places where you can buy land for 180k even existed

That a sacrifice that is required of this generation.

The difference I think we have is you think that's fair and reasonable.

I dont. Especially in SA where new developments in great areas which could make that sacrifice obsolete are hampered or squashed by state planners to protect the value of the property market.

So the ones with existing property get richer and richer, the ones that don't either miss out or have to make huge lifestyle sacrifices.


huge sacrifices? like what my parents did 30 years ago? they moved to the exact sort of area we are talking about. why is this generation any different to them? or why are they any different to what i have had to do? all comes down to what your standards are. id suggest that many have unrealistic expectations.

when the missus and i initially got married and were looking for a house, she wanted to live in campbelltown or somewhere around there. guess what, nothing we could afford. what did we do? whinge about it? nope. we looked into areas that we could afford to live, and moved there. not sure why the next generation coming through shouldnt do the same really.


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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Q. » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:03 pm

Dogwatcher wrote:
Jimmy_041 wrote:Gen Millennials don't want to live in the outer burbs to start in the real estate market

They are entitled to get a $1m house in the CBD so they can enjoy the Hutt St strip


I live out north. I play cricket and talk to a lot of young lads who all went to my private school. I don't know any among them who have this expectation.
I've watched two buy houses out here in the past six months.
Maybe you're making a gross generalisation? Maybe millennials are smarter than some give them credit for?


Exactly. I know the plural of anecdote is not data, but I don't know of a single person who has that expectation.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby tipper » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:06 pm

Q. wrote:
Dogwatcher wrote:
Jimmy_041 wrote:Gen Millennials don't want to live in the outer burbs to start in the real estate market

They are entitled to get a $1m house in the CBD so they can enjoy the Hutt St strip


I live out north. I play cricket and talk to a lot of young lads who all went to my private school. I don't know any among them who have this expectation.
I've watched two buy houses out here in the past six months.
Maybe you're making a gross generalisation? Maybe millennials are smarter than some give them credit for?


Exactly. I know the plural of anecdote is not data, but I don't know of a single person who has that expectation.


well, apart from Morrell......
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Trader » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:10 pm

I felt bad that my data from 1990 was cherry picked, so I plotted the entire 30 years for you Morgs.
Seems we are well within normal operating parameters.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Q. » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:49 pm

The main roadblock to becoming a homeowner is finding a deposit in a climate of wage stagnation and increased cost of living, which is the primary gripe about the current income to mortgage ratio.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Trader » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:52 pm

Q. wrote:The main roadblock to becoming a homeowner is finding a deposit in a climate of wage stagnation and increased cost of living, which is the primary gripe about the current income to mortgage ratio.


I've got no issues with complaints about the cost of living. They are going up much quicker than they should.
But to then point at housing prices and blame them is mere deflection from the service authorities, councils, state and federal governments for mine.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Q. » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:58 pm

Trader wrote:
Q. wrote:The main roadblock to becoming a homeowner is finding a deposit in a climate of wage stagnation and increased cost of living, which is the primary gripe about the current income to mortgage ratio.


I've got no issues with complaints about the cost of living. They are going up much quicker than they should.
But to then point at housing prices and blame them is mere deflection from the service authorities, councils, state and federal governments for mine.


The size of a required deposit is directly linked to an over-priced (due to investment loopholes) housing market.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Trader » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:02 pm

Q. wrote:
Trader wrote:
Q. wrote:The main roadblock to becoming a homeowner is finding a deposit in a climate of wage stagnation and increased cost of living, which is the primary gripe about the current income to mortgage ratio.


I've got no issues with complaints about the cost of living. They are going up much quicker than they should.
But to then point at housing prices and blame them is mere deflection from the service authorities, councils, state and federal governments for mine.


The size of a required deposit is directly linked to an over-priced (due to investment loopholes) housing market.


Correct, but while the multiplier has grown over the last 30 years, the deposit required % of the purchase prices has come down significantly over the same period, so it is no more difficult than it used to be.
Heck, you can even get no deposit loans in some places.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Q. » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:08 pm

Trader wrote:
Q. wrote:
Trader wrote:
Q. wrote:The main roadblock to becoming a homeowner is finding a deposit in a climate of wage stagnation and increased cost of living, which is the primary gripe about the current income to mortgage ratio.


I've got no issues with complaints about the cost of living. They are going up much quicker than they should.
But to then point at housing prices and blame them is mere deflection from the service authorities, councils, state and federal governments for mine.


The size of a required deposit is directly linked to an over-priced (due to investment loopholes) housing market.


Correct, but while the multiplier has grown over the last 30 years, the deposit required % of the purchase prices has come down significantly over the same period, so it is no more difficult than it used to be.
Heck, you can even get no deposit loans in some places.


Which would be ridiculously irresponsible. One really should be saving a minimum deposit of 20% value.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Trader » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:15 pm

For mine its costs like stamp duty that need to be significantly reduced. These costs eat up deposits and also decrease the liquidity within the housing market.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Q. » Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:35 pm

Trader wrote:For mine its costs like stamp duty that need to be significantly reduced. These costs eat up deposits and also decrease the liquidity within the housing market.
That will just inflate house prices further
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby morell » Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:54 pm

I don't want to suck up your ass Q but you honestly make this place just tick over to tolerable.

Trader, I'll respond in detail later.
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The rest of you can suck my nuts.
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Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:54 pm

Trader wrote:For mine its costs like stamp duty that need to be significantly reduced. These costs eat up deposits and also decrease the liquidity within the housing market.


Totally agree
So much for Labor being the party for the poor. One of the first things Kuntsantonis did was to abolish first home owners grants except for CBD off the plan (shows how smart he is)

My son bought a house. First home buyer earning the average salary
Kuntsantonis charges him around $20,000 in stamp duty
Well, screw them. Another negatively geared house hits the market.
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