1964 - 1990

Anything to do with the history of the SANFL

Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Interceptor » Thu Jun 11, 2020 4:12 am

JK wrote:
Wedgie wrote:Which opens up the discussion, even though Norwood won in 82 and 84 I thought they underachieved in the late 80s, early 90s with the talent they had.


So did, but the more Ive reflected over the years Im not so sure. I really felt we were probably the 2nd best side of 87', but as you'd know that North side was pretty special and highly motivated. 1990 is one I reckon we were possibly good enough, 89' too but no others. When you look at our 84' side perhaps we over achieved??

Feel like we should have made a least one more GF after 1984.
Looking at the finals results of the Balme era:

1980-1984 13 wins 4 losses @ 86% (including 3 GF appearances)
1985-1990 4 wins 9 losses @ 30% (including 3 PF appearances in a row 87-89)

Probably a combination of reasons and circumstances for the failings in the mid to late 80s, including losing some pretty handy players like Tim McNeill and Richard Anderson. We seemed to lack potency up forward that other clubs had as Neville Roberts finished his career.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby robranisgod » Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:38 am

Interceptor wrote:
JK wrote:
Wedgie wrote:Which opens up the discussion, even though Norwood won in 82 and 84 I thought they underachieved in the late 80s, early 90s with the talent they had.


So did, but the more Ive reflected over the years Im not so sure. I really felt we were probably the 2nd best side of 87', but as you'd know that North side was pretty special and highly motivated. 1990 is one I reckon we were possibly good enough, 89' too but no others. When you look at our 84' side perhaps we over achieved??

Feel like we should have made a least one more GF after 1984.
Looking at the finals results of the Balme era:

1980-1984 13 wins 4 losses @ 86% (including 3 GF appearances)
1985-1990 4 wins 9 losses @ 30% (including 3 PF appearances in a row 87-89)

Probably a combination of reasons and circumstances for the failings in the mid to late 80s, including losing some pretty handy players like Tim McNeill and Richard Anderson. We seemed to lack potency up forward that other clubs had as Neville Roberts finished his career.


Very interesting stats.

You can read anything you like into stats, but after 1984 Norwood under Neil Balme never beat teams coached by John Cahill or Michael Nunan in a final and only beat Glenelg under Graham Cornes once. I heard Neville Roberts, a former team mate of Balme as well as a dual premiership player, say in 1990 that Balme was being outcoached by the other 3 top coaches of the day. Whether it was Balme's coaching, a lack of forwards, rucks not playing to potential in finals, players becoming too comfortable under Balme and Balme being too loyal to his players, or internal divisions within players, who really knows. I have heard all 5 reasons given as to why the fall off in finals performance in Balme's last 6 years.
Certainly prior to the season in 1990, Norwood were favourites for the flag with the recruitment of A Jarman and Doug Smart, but for whatever reason an on ball division of Aish, Jarman and McIntosh never really gelled and Smart it is fair to say underachieved to such an extent that he was dropped from the team before the end of the season, as was former interstate representative, ruckman John Hall.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby JK » Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:39 pm

robranisgod wrote:
Interceptor wrote:
JK wrote:
Wedgie wrote:Which opens up the discussion, even though Norwood won in 82 and 84 I thought they underachieved in the late 80s, early 90s with the talent they had.


So did, but the more Ive reflected over the years Im not so sure. I really felt we were probably the 2nd best side of 87', but as you'd know that North side was pretty special and highly motivated. 1990 is one I reckon we were possibly good enough, 89' too but no others. When you look at our 84' side perhaps we over achieved??

Feel like we should have made a least one more GF after 1984.
Looking at the finals results of the Balme era:

1980-1984 13 wins 4 losses @ 86% (including 3 GF appearances)
1985-1990 4 wins 9 losses @ 30% (including 3 PF appearances in a row 87-89)

Probably a combination of reasons and circumstances for the failings in the mid to late 80s, including losing some pretty handy players like Tim McNeill and Richard Anderson. We seemed to lack potency up forward that other clubs had as Neville Roberts finished his career.


Very interesting stats.

You can read anything you like into stats, but after 1984 Norwood under Neil Balme never beat teams coached by John Cahill or Michael Nunan in a final and only beat Glenelg under Graham Cornes once. I heard Neville Roberts, a former team mate of Balme as well as a dual premiership player, say in 1990 that Balme was being outcoached by the other 3 top coaches of the day. Whether it was Balme's coaching, a lack of forwards, rucks not playing to potential in finals, players becoming too comfortable under Balme and Balme being too loyal to his players, or internal divisions within players, who really knows. I have heard all 5 reasons given as to why the fall off in finals performance in Balme's last 6 years.
Certainly prior to the season in 1990, Norwood were favourites for the flag with the recruitment of A Jarman and Doug Smart, but for whatever reason an on ball division of Aish, Jarman and McIntosh never really gelled and Smart it is fair to say underachieved to such an extent that he was dropped from the team before the end of the season, as was former interstate representative, ruckman John Hall.


I think we did gel in 1990 around the middle part of the season winning something like 8 on the bounce, including wins over Glenelg and Port Adelaide footy Park and North at Prospect. Then Weeding went down and some lingering off-field issues came to the fore again. My belief has always been that those sides you mentioned had our measure simply because we weren’t as physically hard as them. John Cahill used to say the more a side handled the ball, the less their style stood up in the presssure of finals (not verbatim by you get the drift). I used to think he was fairly and squarely thinking of Norwood when he said that. We tried to play attractive footy as opposed to effective footy and those 3 sides simply found us out. One of our biggest problems was that all of the heavy lifting in the “mongrel” department was left to Macca and not spread enough across the entire playing group.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:55 pm

Interceptor wrote:
JK wrote:
Wedgie wrote:Which opens up the discussion, even though Norwood won in 82 and 84 I thought they underachieved in the late 80s, early 90s with the talent they had.


So did, but the more Ive reflected over the years Im not so sure. I really felt we were probably the 2nd best side of 87', but as you'd know that North side was pretty special and highly motivated. 1990 is one I reckon we were possibly good enough, 89' too but no others. When you look at our 84' side perhaps we over achieved??

Feel like we should have made a least one more GF after 1984.
Looking at the finals results of the Balme era:

1980-1984 13 wins 4 losses @ 86% (including 3 GF appearances)
1985-1990 4 wins 9 losses @ 30% (including 3 PF appearances in a row 87-89)

Probably a combination of reasons and circumstances for the failings in the mid to late 80s, including losing some pretty handy players like Tim McNeill and Richard Anderson. We seemed to lack potency up forward that other clubs had as Neville Roberts finished his career.


Agree Tim McNeil and Richard Anderson were highly skilled footballers
Of all the NW footballers Ive seen, Anderson would be in my top 10-20 most skilled footballers
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Interceptor » Thu Jun 11, 2020 10:45 pm

mal wrote:Agree Tim McNeil and Richard Anderson were highly skilled footballers
Of all the NW footballers Ive seen, Anderson would be in my top 10-20 most skilled footballers

If I recall correctly both won the Rookie of the Year award in their debut seasons.
Anderson was a very smooth running player and I recall a match where he kicked a bag of 5 against Port which was the winning margin.
Had an all too brief stint at Norwood unfortunately.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:52 pm

The one thing about the 1983 Glenelg side it lost a lot of experience after the 1982 season

Paul Weston - Essendon
Graham Cornes - South Adelaide
John Panyter - Sturt

End of 1980 we lost Kym Hodgeman to North Melbourne and one year later Stephen Copping to Essendon.

A lot of quality players lost in a short space of time so a down year was sort of expected but finals would have still been expected, but new recruits brought in as suggested and it took a little time to see the team come together but the back end of the season was out standing. I think at 1 point we won 7 out of 9 so some hope for finals

Peter Maynard in 82
Ross Gibbs
Alan & Wayne Stringer and some young lads in Kidney, Murphy & Salisbury given a chance.

We knew it wasn't going to gel over night and it wasn't as if we were playing really badly just couldn't finish

I suppose as Glenelg people for of us that grew up in Kerley era we just started to expect to win every week and play finals.

When the 10 team comp was introduced in 1964 and we only missed the finals 7 times in the next 27 years until the Crows arrived. As I said we sort of expected to play finals so 83 was a bit of a shock as we did have some talent and did beat Port twice in the season including a win at Alberton of all places but really did enjoy the match at the Bay that year against the Magpies.

The results can be seen in 1984 - 90 that we were one of the best sides around but could only snare 2 flags.
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Let that be a lesson to you Sturt. You don't beat Glenelg 3 times in a row in Grand Finals and get away with it.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Wedgie » Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:56 pm

What year was it when Glenelg came back from a ridiculous margin at 3/4 time in the Foundation Cup against Sturt?
I remember watching the match and it was amazing.
Was shortened quarters and kicked something like 10 goals to nil in the last quarter.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Interceptor » Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:34 am

JK wrote:I think we did gel in 1990 around the middle part of the season winning something like 8 on the bounce, including wins over Glenelg and Port Adelaide footy Park and North at Prospect. Then Weeding went down and some lingering off-field issues came to the fore again. My belief has always been that those sides you mentioned had our measure simply because we weren’t as physically hard as them. John Cahill used to say the more a side handled the ball, the less their style stood up in the presssure of finals (not verbatim by you get the drift). I used to think he was fairly and squarely thinking of Norwood when he said that. We tried to play attractive footy as opposed to effective footy and those 3 sides simply found us out. One of our biggest problems was that all of the heavy lifting in the “mongrel” department was left to Macca and not spread enough across the entire playing group.

That's pretty much right about 1990.
Slowish start, pretty good in the middle, but then the wheels really fell off at the end with thrashings from North and Port in the last 2 rounds before an inglorious exit at the hands of South who had a 9-11 minor round record :roll:

We certainly were bit of a "handball happy" side, which led to over possession.
Perhaps lacking in a bit of toughness sometimes.
1988 sticks out badly where after a good Qualifying win over Centrals we lost Macca (knee) and Kelly (suspension) and then had a disasterous match against Port, although the match against Glenelg ended up being a much closer affair.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Spargo » Fri Jun 12, 2020 8:13 am

Wedgie wrote:What year was it when Glenelg came back from a ridiculous margin at 3/4 time in the Foundation Cup against Sturt?
I remember watching the match and it was amazing.
Was shortened quarters and kicked something like 10 goals to nil in the last quarter.

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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Interceptor » Sat Jun 13, 2020 4:13 am

New SANFL footy flashback on youtube today, highlights of the 1976 Grand Final.

Very good video quality, but unfortunately the audio is badly out of sync.

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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:27 pm

LINDSAY HEAD

This is what Lindsay the artful dodger Head is said to have been doing in at least 1967
First thing is to have his ankles strapped up
Then have a sauna for a few minutes, boots included
Then he would hit the training track

This preparation is said to give his body a bit of flexibility during training
If this is true, I wonder If Lindsay Head did similar b4 SNAFL league matches
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:09 pm

4/51984
Football Park

PA 2-4....10-7...15-13...20-14[134]
NW 5-2...7-3...10-5.......14-7 [91]

I was at this historical match, I was one of the recorded crowd of 19512 who attended
It was on a friday night ,and it was the first match under lights at this venue
I was reasonably happy at quarter time
NW slumped to 2-4 at this stage and in danger of missing finals , but ended up the 1984 Premiers

This was an anniversary match as well
On this day 10 years earlier was another venue historical date

4/5/1974

NA 5-3...9-5...13-9...16-13[109]
CD 4-3..13-4..18-7...21-13[139]

This was the first ever SANFL match played at Football Park
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Interceptor » Sat Jun 20, 2020 5:00 am

mal wrote:4/51984
Football Park

PA 2-4....10-7...15-13...20-14[134]
NW 5-2...7-3...10-5.......14-7 [91]

I was at this historical match, I was one of the recorded crowd of 19512 who attended
It was on a friday night ,and it was the first match under lights at this venue
I was reasonably happy at quarter time
NW slumped to 2-4 at this stage and in danger of missing finals , but ended up the 1984 Premiers

Probably the only satisfying thing about this match for me as a Norwood supporter is the part when Dwayne Russell gets belted.
Peter Marker's commentary was gold:

Peter Marker: "Dwayne Russell is DOWN!"
"Oh Tom Warhurst came in and went BANG!"
...
"Dwayne Russell is holding his face."
"I'll tell you what that is as good a smash as you've even seen!"

See here on the 1984 The Way it Was video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czoN-OS1g7E&t=18m12s
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby JK » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:53 am

Tommy always took it up to DR. Remember the incident you’re talking about, at the time wasn’t sure if it was Tom that got him or Dickinson
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Sat Jun 20, 2020 7:21 pm

The 5AA football team for the 1984 finals included
David Nipper Christie
Noel Teasdale
Dennis DB Browne
MALcolm Blight

An iconic cliche I can recall made famous by DB over the years
" Heez kicked a sausage roll."
A sausage roll being a goal

David Christie played in Woodvilles first ever game in 1964
He is also the first ever Woodville footballer to play 100 games
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:20 pm

Just imagine if the zones were unchanged and MALcolm Blight played for PA

What about this play
B Light kicks to Blight

Bruce Light was a star wingman for PA

:rolleyes:
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Tue Jun 30, 2020 8:24 pm

Gone With The Wind ?
I had always thought that some times Football Park was not an even playing field
Been to several games where the wind intensity has dropped or strengthened after the toss of the coin
I had always tried to punt on sides using a strong breeze early, as a drop in wind velocity was on the cards at times

Has anyone got any recollections of matches where the wind changed, dropped or intensified ?
Did the wind change prove costly to the losing teams ?
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby Spargo » Tue Jun 30, 2020 8:29 pm

mal wrote:Gone With The Wind ?
I had always thought that some times Football Park was not an even playing field
Been to several games where the wind intensity has dropped or strengthened after the toss of the coin
I had always tried to punt on sides using a strong breeze early, as a drop in wind velocity was on the cards at times

Has anyone got any recollections of matches where the wind changed, dropped or intensified ?
Did the wind change prove costly to the losing teams ?

You’ve mentioned the ‘81 Prelim previously.
The 1990 GF shits me the most.
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby mal » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:52 pm

Spargo
Just watched the early part of the PA V GL 1990 g/f

PA had the breeze in the first qtr
This is what Kym Dillon said at the 29 minute mark of the 1qtr
"That breeze that was initially favoring the southern end seems to have subsided slightly and is going across the ground
Perhaps it maybe even swinging to the northern end."
At quarter time Kym Dillon re-iterated that the breeze had turned around a little bit

GL 5-2....6-7...9-11.....13-15[93]
PA 4-6...10-7...13-9...16-12[108]
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Re: 1964 - 1990

Postby FlyingHigh » Fri Jul 03, 2020 10:18 am

Currently reading a biography on Phil Carman.

It talks about how upset and unsettled he became when Robert Oatey was sacked in 1973 and Bob Hammond became coach, after all that Oatey had done for Carman as a youngster, and how Carman perceived Norwood handled the situation

What were the circumstances around and reasons for Robert Oatey's sacking after they had just finished third in 1973? Was Bob Hammond an authoritarian disciplinarian or was it all on Carman in 1974? What are some of the memories of Carman around that time and any notable differences in Carman between 1973 and 74?
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