Gaza FC - Salary Cap Breaches

[redyellow&blue]

Might also add that for an offence apparently so serious to warrant an extraordinary fine/huge suspensions that 4 APPS points seems a bit trifling? One player a year?

Yep 100%.

Real misalignment between the financial fine and the players fine.

Personally if the breaches were 'so serious' then imo a fair result would be the club can still operate but they would have next to no points (which can be tracked through APPS) and that we would see them drop through down through the grades.

At the moment its hard to see how they would open the doors with such a fine.

No one learns that way. Why would it be fair? how many clubs would have lost or been relegated because GAZA were not playing fair by being over the cap and rorting the system?


I would hazard a guess that GAZA have
- been over the cap by big $$ for more then before 2018
- it's endemic at the club with multiple parties involved.
- It's cultural at some clubs to do this kind of thing.

Id' go as far to even suspend the players that got extra payments from playing in any comp anywhere for a year, and ban then from being allowed to sign contracts for 5 years. You want to play? play for free champ.

That's what would p!ss me off if I was an administrator of a club. The players seem to get off without punishment. Very happy to take the money

Exactly, I think it'll be a nice topic at the next Adelaide Footy league meeting....

[whufc]

What would happen with the $350k.

Would it just sit in the coffers at HQ.....

Is there a better use for the $$$$$$. If SAAFL were receiving that amount of money i would expect them to outline exactly how that money is going to benefit football/juniors/clubs in the SAAFL. Not just the generic 'will go towards a sustainable comp' because you would never expect to strike gold with that level of money for nothing which it essentially is as the SAAFL weren't financially out of pocket from Gaza breaches (unless there is lawyer fees etc then its totally understandable)

WHOA... hold up.

This had nothing to do with the Adelaide Footy League, and they were kept independent of any investigations.

It's the South Australian Community Football League - which are a sub-committee of the SANFL.

AdFL only get told as a courtesy that one of their clubs is being investigated, I don't even think they're told WHO is being investigated until much later down the track.

Yeah saw that on the below post which is why i asked the question. Point remains the same....feel there has to be a better way for the money to be spent than the SANFL just using it for 'operational costs'

[jo172]

Definitely takes two to tango, from memory when Kybolite got done the players involved copped a slap on the wrists at least?

EDIT: https://sanfl.com.au/league/news/kybybolite-fc-accepts-penalties-for-player-salary-cap-breach/

Individual penalties

Club official John Cooper suspended for three years from holding any official role with an affiliated League or club and fined $2,000.
Senior coach at the time, Tim Leehane, suspended for 12 months from holding any official role with an affiliated League or club and fined $1,000.
Player Lachlan McGregor fined $3,500 ($1,000 of which is suspended) and suspended for eight matches in the 2019 season.
A second player, whose name is supressed, fined $1,500 ($1,000 of which is suspended) and suspended for two matches in the 2019 season.

[whufc]

You punish the players and guess what never happens again.......players dobbing in clubs which is pretty much the only way clubs can be proven of a breach.

What it does become though is a massive 'buyer beware' as most clubs will know who the players dobbing in clubs are.

[Brodlach]

You punish the players and guess what never happens again.......players dobbing in clubs which is pretty much the only way clubs can be proven of a breach.

That’s what occurred in the above case. Not the smartest lad

[Footy Chick]

Sorry, i need to make a correction... and this will probably make more sense with the ratio of fine to points:

We're talking fines of over $300k,will play with only 4 APPS points for the next 2 years (ie, loss of 11 points) and several club administrators have been banned from taking official positions for periods of anywhere from 5-10 years. They have 7 days to dispute the result.

[jo172]

Thanks FC, that makes much more sense.

[Jimmy_041]

Might also add that for an offence apparently so serious to warrant an extraordinary fine/huge suspensions that 4 APPS points seems a bit trifling? One player a year?

Yep 100%.

Real misalignment between the financial fine and the players fine.

Personally if the breaches were 'so serious' then imo a fair result would be the club can still operate but they would have next to no points (which can be tracked through APPS) and that we would see them drop through down through the grades.

At the moment its hard to see how they would open the doors with such a fine.

I agree the fine is totally excessive, unless their books showed the could afford it. They are dropping down the grades even with the rorting

I am no longer involved in footy admin but, from memory, the fine is equal to the over payment

[Bluedemon]

what is the salary cap in the Adelaide Football League?

[cracka]

$300k fine for anything involving semi amateur sport seems extremely excessive, feel for the junior football program which will suffer as a result.

EDIT - be ready for the deluge of players that will self report before the clubs can do it...

It's curious isn't it.

I've been expecting the deluge every time a club has been pinged (Padthaway and Willaston for example) but it's never seemed to come for whatever reason.

A lot of players wouldn't even know the rules

I doubt there's any players that don't know the maximum payment per game is $500 plus fuel levy

[Brodlach]

$2500 per week?

[jo172]

Might also add that for an offence apparently so serious to warrant an extraordinary fine/huge suspensions that 4 APPS points seems a bit trifling? One player a year?

Yep 100%.

Real misalignment between the financial fine and the players fine.

Personally if the breaches were 'so serious' then imo a fair result would be the club can still operate but they would have next to no points (which can be tracked through APPS) and that we would see them drop through down through the grades.

At the moment its hard to see how they would open the doors with such a fine.

I agree the fine is totally excessive, unless their books showed the could afford it. They are dropping down the grades even with the rorting

I am no longer involved in footy admin but, from memory, the fine is equal to the over payment

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content/uploads/2023/08/01091255/Community-Football-Updated-Regulations-September-2023-2.pdf

Note these are from the rules as updated today, not sure if the penalties can be applied retrospectively.

So if it had happened for four years that's approx 72 matches. So $72,000 for every breach, that would tend to suggest payments of $280k or thereabouts over the cap or $70k a year.

Noting the cap for a year was between $45k and $60k this would indicate that the payments would have been between two times and three times the amount permitted by the Cap.

(this is all obviously speculative reverse engineering)

[Jimmy_041]

You punish the players and guess what never happens again.......players dobbing in clubs which is pretty much the only way clubs can be proven of a breach.

What it does become though is a massive 'buyer beware' as most clubs will know who the players dobbing in clubs are.

The CFL can offer immunity to players and officials for their testimony

The elephant in the room is the Stat Dec from the club although I have no knowledge how they work in clubs for this.

But signing a false one is a criminal act - Conviction leads to jail for up to 4 years

TBS is probably already on the phone

[amber_fluid]

If they can afford to over pay the salary cap by that much then they can afford to pay the excessive fine.
Simple really.

[cracka]

Definitely takes two to tango, from memory when Kybolite got done the players involved copped a slap on the wrists at least?

EDIT: https://sanfl.com.au/league/news/kybybolite-fc-accepts-penalties-for-player-salary-cap-breach/

Individual penalties

Club official John Cooper suspended for three years from holding any official role with an affiliated League or club and fined $2,000.
Senior coach at the time, Tim Leehane, suspended for 12 months from holding any official role with an affiliated League or club and fined $1,000.
Player Lachlan McGregor fined $3,500 ($1,000 of which is suspended) and suspended for eight matches in the 2019 season.
A second player, whose name is supressed, fined $1,500 ($1,000 of which is suspended) and suspended for two matches in the 2019 season.

Maybe the fine for players should be what they actually received over what they should have received.

[Armchair expert]

Its okay, just get your players jobs, free uni, discounts, free stuff, netball contracts etc. etc.

[cracka]

Its okay, just get your players jobs, free uni, discounts, free stuff, netball contracts etc. etc.

Or if the player has a business, pay them for services that don't actually get done or well overpay for their services

[Armchair expert]

Its okay, just get your players jobs, free uni, discounts, free stuff, netball contracts etc. etc.

Or if the player has a business, pay them for services that don't actually get done or well overpay for their services

Exactly, Gaza being punished for not being creative in how you "rort" the salary cap.

[amber_fluid]

Its okay, just get your players jobs, free uni, discounts, free stuff, netball contracts etc. etc.

Or if the player has a business, pay them for services that don't actually get done or well overpay for their services

I guess that’s all ‘within the rules’ so they can.
What Gaza did isn't.

[jo172]

Its okay, just get your players jobs, free uni, discounts, free stuff, netball contracts etc. etc.

Or if the player has a business, pay them for services that don't actually get done or well overpay for their services

Least the ATO gets a cut that way