Carlton

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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby Turbo » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:49 pm

gadj1976 wrote:
stan wrote:Before we totally hang Malthouse. Take into consideration that so far Carlton have played Richmond, West Coast, Essendon and St.kilda. West Coast was away and Rich and Ess played finals last season. Sitting 1-3 is probably where you would think they would be at this stage.


This is my argument though. Our list is where it's at because of Malthouse. We wouldn't be in the position we are if it weren't for him.

Gone from our list since 2012;

Betts - Adelaide
Bootsma - delisted
Bower - delisted
Collins - delisted
Davies - delisted
Duigan - retired
Garlett - Melbourne
Hampson - Richmond
Joseph - delisted
Kerr - delisted
Lucas - delisted
Mitchell - delisted
McCarthy - delisted
McLean - delisted
McInnes - delisted
O'Keeffe - delisted
Robinson - Brisbane
Russell - Collingwood - delisted
Scotland - retired
Thornton - GWS - delisted
Waite - North Melbourne
Rookies;
only Casboult remains

So that's 21 players turned over and we've got worse. We have been in 2012, 2013 and 2014 drafts and not addressed our backline or forwardline deficiencies (in part caused by sending Waite, Garlett and Betts on their way).

The guys we've brought in, Daisy Thomas (which addressed a problem we didn't have). Jones (couldn't make the Bulldogs forward line) and Tutt (ditto).

Yes, our development has been ordinary but isn't that the coach's fault? It certainly seemed to be when everyone else was in charge.

Oh and that doesn't include Laidler who was told his style didn't fit our game. Suits Sydney ok!


Poor coaching or poor recruiting. Most of those names were not Afl quality to begin with.

Betts was a loss but left for family reasons and Thomas may have been an expensive mistake.

Robinson and Garlett sacked for lying to the club after given a number of chances.

Laidler was injury prone

Waite is injury prone or susceptible to being reported.

And it goes on. None of these players were going to have a long term impact at the club.

Recruited more recently Menzel and Cripps look like real players and for boekhurst it's too early.

Not sure if sacking a coach now is the right answer. As I keep saying they will resign Mick for 2 with a possibility of a 3rd. They made their decision to get him. Reckon they'll stick with him.




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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby Coorong » Fri May 01, 2015 12:57 pm

Surely the committee would wanna be chatting with bomber thompson

Nah...an ex Brisbane coach
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby Ron Burgundy » Fri May 01, 2015 1:57 pm

Carlton will win tonight
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby gadj1976 » Fri May 01, 2015 9:52 pm

Nup, you blokes are dead right. We are on the right path and Malthouse should get, 2, 3, 5... **** it, give him 20 years! FFS.
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Fri May 01, 2015 11:07 pm

Coorong wrote:Surely the committee would wanna be chatting with bomber thompson

Nah...an ex Brisbane coach


what as if, replace the elderly with another elderly thats crazy

i reckon carlton have more big name footballers than collingwood, but yet collingwood by 80 points

the amount of names u hear of what should be "gun" footballers, but yet theres just this mediocre expectation that none of those boys in blue are about to light up this football game

none of them have the energy to reach an B-minus, and carltons best player might get a C+ for his game

they really are in desperate need of a spark up their arse, cos the belief they have in themselves is so dented, their own expectation is sub standard

it must be the culture, it must be the leadership, theres no one there to convince them how good they can be

enter bomber thompson please
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby bennymacca » Fri May 01, 2015 11:33 pm

marbles wrote:the amount of names u hear of what should be "gun" footballers, but yet theres just this mediocre expectation that none of those boys in blue are about to light up this football game


you should be able to mention gibbs and murphy comfortably in the same sentence as swan and pendlebury but they arent even remotely close. Im not even sure they are genuine A graders of the comp, which would mean that carlton would have zero of them (Judd is a bit too old now)
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby gadj1976 » Fri May 01, 2015 11:56 pm

It's easy for anyone to look ordinary in an ordinary side. That's where we're at. We look terrible cos we are! We're running and receiving the ball in the wrong positions, we have no confidence and our skills are terrible. They are A graders but how many blokes win Brownlows in teams at the bottom of the ladder?
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Sat May 02, 2015 12:08 am

I think there's about 7 or 8 agraders in carltons side but every player barely looks like a cgrader right now

Players are simply just soldiers taking orders from either outstanding leaders or shithouse leaders

Malthouse IMO is to old to give a shit about the journey of these young men and to senile in applying blueprints to see them flourish, he couldn't careless where these boys might be in 5 years, its all about him, he is the centre of his world not the players and that makes him the wrong man for the job
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby Q. » Sat May 02, 2015 12:11 am

Still playing that boundary skirting game plan that was countered by most teams about 3-4 years ago.
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby gadj1976 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:24 am

Q. wrote:Still playing that boundary skirting game plan that was countered by most teams about 3-4 years ago.


FINALLY, someone who understands that it's the out of date game plan!!!!! Hoo FRIGGEN RAY!
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby gadj1976 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:31 am

marbles wrote:I think there's about 7 or 8 agraders in carltons side but every player barely looks like a cgrader right now

Players are simply just soldiers taking orders from either outstanding leaders or shithouse leaders

Malthouse IMO is to old to give a shit about the journey of these young men and to senile in applying blueprints to see them flourish, he couldn't careless where these boys might be in 5 years, its all about him, he is the centre of his world not the players and that makes him the wrong man for the job


Completely agree with that comment Marbles.

I seriously don't agree with your last comment though. I really don't think he's trying to stuff them up, I just think his gameplan is 'old school' in comparison to new coaches. Look at the bullies for instance. They're flourishing under a new coach with new ideas and relevant game plan. One of my major gripes with Mick is that you can't turn lists over like you used to. So if he brings a game plan in, he can't spend 4 years bringing in players he wants to implement that game plan, you have to work the game plan around what you've got. He didn't do that with us. We weren't that far away when he came in. Now we're a million miles away.
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Carlton 2015

Postby Jim05 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:59 am

Not sure there is 7-8 A graders in that side ATM, close to the worst list in the comp.
14 guys with 2 or less tackles tonight, Bryce Squibbs didnt lay a single friggin tackle and he is meant to be a leader
Doesnt help when you have a skipper who didnt want the job and who is a soft as butter, seems a real lack of leadership.
Definately no quick fix, will take some good drafting in the next few years to get them near the top 8. You can join the list of also rans along with us if you like lol
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Sat May 02, 2015 1:45 am

Being a coach is about painting a picture in the players minds to inspire them to be the best they can be. Carlton has minimal cattle yes but all men hav work ethic but not at Carlton as the current coach is not the man leading the crusade to our next premiership

The players want a coach who will take them there

Don't let micks outstanding rhetoric in front of the media convince u that he is fit for the job. He has been an outstanding coach but as an elderly man he is not man to take us to a 2018 premiership

At least ratten had the drive to win a flag and most of the boys excelled behind him. Mick has no hunger so who is he really leading to excellence... No one
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby daysofourlives » Sat May 02, 2015 10:30 am

gadj1976 wrote:It's easy for anyone to look ordinary in an ordinary side. That's where we're at. We look terrible cos we are! We're running and receiving the ball in the wrong positions, we have no confidence and our skills are terrible. They are A graders but how many blokes win Brownlows in teams at the bottom of the ladder?


Wrong, you dont run to recieve at all and i mean at all. you had 15 marks at half time, that is just a side that is either lazy, unfit or doesnt have the will, i think its the latter.
To me that performance alone is enough to move Malthouse on, has clearly lost the players. Walker and Gibbs arnt interested, trade them while they have currency, Richmond and North could do with some more recycled nuffies
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby MJ_23 » Mon May 04, 2015 9:42 am

Who would be your 7/8 A graders marbles? I think you are being very generous
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Mon May 04, 2015 10:29 am

MJ_23 wrote:Who would be your 7/8 A graders marbles? I think you are being very generous


firstly im a man like most coaches who has belief in his players, have you ever heard malthouse say anything good about any player?

Under a coach who'd wants nothing but the best for his players these boys would reach great heights...

# Judd
# Walker
# Henderson
# Gibbs
# Casbult
# Yarren
# Menzel
# Everitt
# Jamison
# Murphy - although is a shit captain

These boys would shine in any other team, for instance chuck the individual in the Hawthorn side

Under a regime, where the coach or coaches are drilling excellence these boys would flourish

at carlton, bad leaders, bad game structure, and all the players are half asleep, and not even $200,000 a year (average) is making them do their job
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby gadj1976 » Mon May 04, 2015 10:38 am

I read that Mick is coaching Cas on how to kick. I would've thought that he'd be worth getting a dedicated kicking coach in for. I also noted he hardly got a kick for the Nth Blues on the weekend too. Another one that could leave us if not treated well and coached accordingly.

Marbles, completely agree. Couldn't have said it any better myself.
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Mon May 04, 2015 10:55 am

gadj1976 wrote:I read that Mick is coaching Cas on how to kick. I would've thought that he'd be worth getting a dedicated kicking coach in for. I also noted he hardly got a kick for the Nth Blues on the weekend too. Another one that could leave us if not treated well and coached accordingly.

Marbles, completely agree. Couldn't have said it any better myself.


casbult is the best pack mark in the league, when your coach barely gives you the time of day and chucks you in the ressies, casbult probably feels like he aint gonna get a a game for as long as malthouse in charge. the kids depressed

i cant believe the money travis cloke, and drew petrie would be on, theyd barely get 5 kicks between them. if they get a run, then casbult deserves a chance to shine
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby bennymacca » Mon May 04, 2015 10:58 am

marbles wrote:
MJ_23 wrote:Who would be your 7/8 A graders marbles? I think you are being very generous


firstly im a man like most coaches who has belief in his players, have you ever heard malthouse say anything good about any player?

Under a coach who'd wants nothing but the best for his players these boys would reach great heights...

# Judd
# Walker
# Henderson
# Gibbs
# Casbult
# Yarren
# Menzel
# Everitt
# Jamison
# Murphy - although is a shit captain

These boys would shine in any other team, for instance chuck the individual in the Hawthorn side

Under a regime, where the coach or coaches are drilling excellence these boys would flourish

at carlton, bad leaders, bad game structure, and all the players are half asleep, and not even $200,000 a year (average) is making them do their job


Casboult, Yarran, Everitt, Jamison would all struggle to get a game at Hawthorn, let alone flourish. If Shaun Burgoyne can go from an A grade midfielder to a bit part half back flanker (though a very good one) in the Hawks team then it doesnt bode well for the guys you mentioned.

Henderson is nowhere near an A Grader. He would need to kick somewhere near 50 goals a year to even be in the conversation, and his best season he has managed 28.

Aside from Judd who is obviously one of the games greats, but too old to be considered an A grader, Menzel, Walker, Gibbs, Murphy are probably the ones that have the potential to be considered A graders.

But aside from probably walker, all of those would be pretty far below their expectations. Menzel has an excuse because he is still young and has had a few injuries.

The real problem is a lack of leadership. Murphy and Gibbs are the leaders of that club now, and when carlton are 4 goals down they should grab the game by the scruff of the neck and will their teammates to come with them. But they dont. They roll over.

That was a problem before mick was there and will be a problem after he as left
Last edited by bennymacca on Mon May 04, 2015 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Carlton 2015

Postby marbles » Mon May 04, 2015 11:03 am

your right, none of them right now are barely cgraders right now, theyre in an institution that is denying them the chance to flourish.

all our ex-players a shining at other clubs

football is all above the shoulders (or whatever that saying is)
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