Club Payments Crackdown

Adelaide Footy League Talk

Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby oyster » Fri Jul 24, 2015 6:23 pm

sideview wrote:Had an interesting comment passed onto me today in regards to Salary Cap and APPS.
The Salary Cap / APPS committee are expecting a number of country clubs to fold due to the new salary cap regulations. Hence I would suggest there will be no discussion in regards to a phase in period or adjustment of the salary cap for any affiliated leagues.
They are expecting clubs in regional South Australia including the South East, Mallee, Riverland, Adelaide Plains and other regional areas to not be able to continue due to lack of numbers. Obviously these people have no affiliation with country towns who's only source of social interaction is through sport on the weekends. Almost ruling football by abolishing freedom of choice, causing social exclusion for regional communities.
I think all people agree a salary cap is required but to submit clubs to a ridiculous amount along with the APPS is both unwarranted and unproductive in what the CFL is trying to achieve.
Leanne Grantham commented 90% of presidents agreed with salary cap I would like to see that list and I would also like to see what response those 90% would have at the proposed changes. I think now that people have had a chance to study the proposal would agree the changes are to severe and probably at least a three year phase in period was warranted. All the CFL will achieve now is to drive payments under the table even further.
The other predicament the CFL will find themselves in relates to the APPS points being used as punishment. How can this be unless directed solely at the SAAFL as they are the only league who have every team on the same points (15). Every other league that I know of have varied points. 3 years ago pretty sure Tanunda was on 1 point so how does taking all there APPS points away equate to the same as taking all of Kingston's 20 points away. I would have thought all APPS points would have to be equal to use as punishment.
To Leanne Grantham and David Shipway you have yelled from the rafters how good the Country Championships were, and how good football is in our state, so why are we looking to make such monumental changes. Agree we needed changes but the sledgehammer approach wreaks of desperation. A last ditch effort to save the SANFL and what a bonus for the SAAFL pity about everybody else.


I wouldn't worry about what Shipway or Grantham have to say. At least 5 of the country leagues are saying NO. The FFL are irrelevant to what the country leagues want. All the FFL want is to prop up an ailing SANFL Ressies and an ailing SAAFL, which all the good players are leaving BOTH for greener pastures, better lifestyle and more money in the country. I'll bet anyone here that a minimum of 5 country leagues say NO. When the other leagues then see 5 saying no then many others will also say no, for fear of losing players for 0 points.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby oyster » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:49 pm

Heard another league about 200 clicks up the track from me voted tonight. Not happening at that league either. They fear many of the their clubs would collapse if not for imported players from the smoke
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby LaughingKookaburra » Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:39 pm

On your prior post. On what basis is the SAAFL ailing? From my beginning the standards in the mid to lower divisions are a lot better compared to 15 years ago and I've seen this through both playing and viewing. How many country leagues can say even on a scale are as good as they were 15 years ago? When I played a season in Mildura I was amazed at the fantastic standard in both League and Reserves, everyone I spoke to said it was a lot better 20 years ago. Hear the same stories all the time about Riverland, Murray, Spencer Gulf and especially Western Border and Southern.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby Feenix » Tue Jul 28, 2015 1:43 pm

oyster wrote:Heard another league about 200 clicks up the track from me voted tonight. Not happening at that league either. They fear many of the their clubs would collapse if not for imported players from the smoke

Did you hear this down the pub as well
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby daysofourlives » Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:53 pm

I hear the guernsey supplier's contract is up for tender to the SACFL.
They wouldn't opt for a new one would they? Every club in the state would be up for around 15k next year if they did, now that is some serious coin for the winning tender, Wouldnt be any kickbacks to the snout's trough would there?
At a time when they are telling us clubs will go to the wall if something is not done about spending surely they wouldnt put this impost on everyone
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby oyster » Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:07 pm

Got to the footy club earlier and lots of yap about salary cap, yarda, yarda, yarda. Our league going to toe the line after all the noise about not. They said only 4 leagues won't toe the line now. Disappointing. 4 leagues is better than none.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby LaughingKookaburra » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:37 pm

So how is the SAAFL ailing Oyster?
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby Look Good In Leather » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:38 pm

LaughingKookaburra wrote:So how is the SAAFL ailing Oyster?

2 folded clubs recently, another 2-4 on the brink. Not all is well
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby LaughingKookaburra » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:57 pm

Thanks Oyster. 1 club could still be in existence however could not fill 2 sides which has been the same situation for a long time. Hardly ailing.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby oyster » Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:59 pm

Great Southern, Hills, Yorkes and Barossa are stronger than ever before. All the good players are leaving the ammos in droves for more money, better lifestyle, better day of footy and community atmosphere. That how the ammos are ailing. With 4 leagues not abiding by the salary cap laws that they're trying to push through means more players will get taken from the ammos. An ammo club can only spend $3,000 a game and 4 leagues will now have no $$$$ restrictions and all 0 point players coming in. Ammo clubs won't compete. Ammo clubs will be pushing shit right up hill to compete.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby Q. » Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:34 pm

oyster wrote:Great Southern, Hills, Yorkes and Barossa are stronger than ever before. All the good players are leaving the ammos in droves for more money, better lifestyle, better day of footy and community atmosphere. That how the ammos are ailing. With 4 leagues not abiding by the salary cap laws that they're trying to push through means more players will get taken from the ammos. An ammo club can only spend $3,000 a game and 4 leagues will now have no $$$$ restrictions and all 0 point players coming in. Ammo clubs won't compete. Ammo clubs will be pushing shit right up hill to compete.

Actually, for the past two years the SAAFL has had more clearances in from country leagues than clearances going out.

If it is as you say it is - better lifestyle, footy, atmosphere - then surely the cap won't matter because it isn't the money that attracts players to these leagues.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby LaughingKookaburra » Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:43 pm

You said it was at leastdouble the leagues last week. What stats show droves of players are leaving the SAAFL for the country? you're being very general with your statements and statistics mate with little factual information. Our country towns fork out a fair bit of coin already but now they are going to fork out heaps more and suck div 4 amateur clubs dry of players..... Please! Go to a league meeting and keep away from pubs and footy club bars mate. Fair Dinkum!
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby oyster » Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:09 pm

Another league tonight voted against salary $$$$&& cap I was just told
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:22 pm

Start naming the Leagues or otherwise it can be taken as Fiction with no basis of truth and incorrect miss-leading statements!!!!!
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby Red Rocket » Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:42 pm

FOURTH ESTATE wrote:Start naming the Leagues or otherwise it can be taken as Fiction with no basis of truth and incorrect miss-leading statements!!!!!

Dont know what Oyster has heard but my understanding at this stage its 5 comps.
Know for a fact the BL&G is one and have heard the Hills, Yorke, Adelaide Plains and Great Southern are the others, not sure how much is fact and how much is rumour on those four.
The BL&G has a meeting soon, sounds like they will only accept it if the cap is raised to a suitable level and the points system is overhauled. At this stage every club in the comp is dead against it in its current format but are willing to sit down and discuss it.
A lot of clubs are worried about the potential fines that a volunteer could be hit with for simple errors.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby laser » Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:27 pm

A few of the reasons I've heard why this got voted up by the SAAFL as a member of the SACFL -
  • We need to get player payments under control as concerns are being expressed by the AFL on clubs across Australia being compliant with tax, workcover, super etc. obligations.
  • Given this being the main driver, its coming and we need to get the best out of it we can.
  • Restrictions on player movement (APPS I assume) only inflates the amount paid to individuals. This escalates I assume once a player comes back to zero points, he can demand more money knowing to replace him would cost points.
  • It is likely to be less onerous on clubs to administer the cap than it would be to raise more money each year just to remain competitive. Interesting, I wouldn't like to be one stuffing up with a clerical error and causing the loss of premiership points etc.

I'm not a big fan, but if we have to have it, we make it work for footy. As far as the cap amount, I'd like to see it lowered. A lot. $30k should be more than enough for an SAAFL club. Can't speak for country clubs. But right now without a cap how much do the BL&G league clubs care about Mallee League clubs trying to compete to attract players? Do clubs want it to be more about who can raise the more money wins? There probably can be some work applied to the cap rules for the rural clubs (a long way from available players) where petrol money alone won't treat the travel costs, as well as coach payment limits. And probably other areas as well.

Regulation can work in footy. The almost there socialism for the NFL in the USA works quite well with drafts and salary caps. It isn't too onerous to regulate compliance within a relatively small number of competitors. Given we have a similar setup with our indigenous game at grass roots, we could get a good outcome as well. I don't know if a salary cap has been attempted in soccer, but it would be interesting to see a comparison of the spread of winners across competitors in the Premier League, NFL and AFL over a period of time that covers salary cap vs. no salary cap. There, I'll have a lie down now.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby morell » Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:44 am

Great post laser and I agree with most of it.

Would anyone be against a league specific cap? As I agree, any club in the SAAFL should be able to operate on and be competitive with $30k, but understand that wouldn't be enough for the rural leagues.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby jo172 » Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:50 am

morell wrote:Great post laser and I agree with most of it.

Would anyone be against a league specific cap? As I agree, any club in the SAAFL should be able to operate on and be competitive with $30k, but understand that wouldn't be enough for the rural leagues.


The amount of any cap needs to be proportionate to the caps in the immediately neighboring leagues.

If ours is to be $30k you wouldn't want the APFL, BLG League, RMFL, Hills League, SFL or GSFL to be on much more than $35k.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby morell » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:03 am

Yeah I agree.

This sounds like a geographic problem to me. There should be some sort of measure or analysis done to determine how far out from the city, on average, the clubs are for that league, and then determine some sort of weighting or per km cost to work out the cap for that comp.
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Re: Club Payments Crackdown

Postby Mr Beefy » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:17 am

laser wrote:
  • We need to get player payments under control as concerns are being expressed by the AFL on clubs across Australia being compliant with tax, workcover, super etc. obligations.
  • Given this being the main driver, its coming and we need to get the best out of it we can.

I'm not a big fan, but if we have to have it, we make it work for footy. As far as the cap amount, I'd like to see it lowered. A lot. $30k should be more than enough for an SAAFL club.

What a lot of baloney! If it's a hobby for umpires, then its a hobby for players.
$30k is one player for some of these far flung clubs. Probably what your mob are paying 2 players alone.
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