SA Footy

I doubt the Crows and Power Reserves players will feel losses in the same way as players on the proper teams will.

gadj1976 wrote:

Apachebulldog wrote:All the past rhetoric from posters that they will not play to win is B/S.

That's why players run out onto the turf they are out there to WIN.

My personal view is the Power and Crows with their multi million dollar budgets should have the edge on some SANFL clubs which have been struggling financially over the last couple of years

I guess only time will tell.

That's all well and good to say that, but the Crows and Port will manage their players through.

They'll know exactly how long players should be out there, especially from rehab (N V Berlo is one that comes to mind, T Walker, another). So yes, they'll be playing to win. But "win" will be winning a place back in the league side. The young guys will be there trying to impress, rather than winning game of footy. The coaches are there to develop players, not win ressies premierships.

They'll talk about "the process" and "the scoreboard taking care of itself" and "managing game time" for their players. Which seriously, is why they wanted a stand alone side in the first place!

I'll put 5 bucks on someone from the Crows saying "the scoreboard doesn't matter" in the first 6 weeks of the season.

And that is the one concern I do have with the proposal.

The Sleeping Giant wrote:The young up and coming player argument is a load of crap. Talent scouts everywhere. No one with potential to play afl is getting over looked.

According to some forum users they are. There was a thread "Kenny Macgregor top ten AFL duds" or something & on that according to some forum users there were a lot of players who shouldn't be playing AFL versus players that have been missed.

tigerpie wrote:Now we have to put up with playing meaningless games against 2 teams that are not there for the same reason as the established clubs.

No we (the supporters) don't. Four weekends to spend doing the gardening.

valleys07 wrote:Not having a crack at anybody in particular, but what argument will it be? One minute the 2 AFL sides wont give a rats toss about winning, but another post highlights the supposed advantage both will have. Either way port and adelaide will be critiqued regardless of ladder position.

Precisely that. Either situation is problematic. There is no way that the presence of reserve teams in the SANFL will result in a competition which is equal, uncompromised, and retaining integrity. Neither team belongs, and the sooner they are pissed off to a reserves competition the better.

valleys07 wrote:You dont think that a young player coming through a magpies or crows academy side and training under AFL standard coaches would benefit at all?

or even young players coming through the other clubs playing in front of a team that has a direct link to a AFL club in his state,or that AFL coach is there watching the game.

I'v heard Collingwood and Carlton are sitting back with a wait and see approach with how the SANFL goes this year.
If it can maintain a similar standard to previous years they are more than keen to enter their reserves team in the SANFL as they see it as being much stronger than the VFL, They are probably the only clubs with the resources to be able to do it financially.

daysofourlives wrote:I'v heard Collingwood and Carlton are sitting back with a wait and see approach with how the SANFL goes this year.
If it can maintain a similar standard to previous years they are more than keen to enter their reserves team in the SANFL as they see it as being much stronger than the VFL, They are probably the only clubs with the resources to be able to do it financially.

If this is from Melb, rowe or jars then it's nothing but crap.

kickinit wrote:

valleys07 wrote:You dont think that a young player coming through a magpies or crows academy side and training under AFL standard coaches would benefit at all?

or even young players coming through the other clubs playing in front of a team that has a direct link to a AFL club in his state,or that AFL coach is there watching the game.

They have done for years. AFL reserve teams won't make a lick of difference to extra numbers being drafted from the SANFL. Coaches and scouts have always been at SANFL games. Interstate teams aren't just pulling a name out of a hat when drafting.

daysofourlives wrote:I'v heard Collingwood and Carlton are sitting back with a wait and see approach with how the SANFL goes this year.
If it can maintain a similar standard to previous years they are more than keen to enter their reserves team in the SANFL as they see it as being much stronger than the VFL, They are probably the only clubs with the resources to be able to do it financially.

Thats the most outlandish crock of excrement ive ever heard.

The Sleeping Giant wrote:

kickinit wrote:

valleys07 wrote:You dont think that a young player coming through a magpies or crows academy side and training under AFL standard coaches would benefit at all?

or even young players coming through the other clubs playing in front of a team that has a direct link to a AFL club in his state,or that AFL coach is there watching the game.

They have done for years. AFL reserve teams won't make a lick of difference to extra numbers being drafted from the SANFL. Coaches and scouts have always been at SANFL games. Interstate teams aren't just pulling a name out of a hat when drafting.

Never said it would make a difference to the numbers being drafted, was actually talking about it being a advantage to the other SANFL clubs. Simply stating when a kid is playing against the crows or Port Adelaide MAGPIES, he might just push that little harder or hit the contest harder. Knowing that he is playing against mainly AFL listed players and that even if there wasn't a scout or coach from the AFL there, that the SANFL coaches would be passing on the message to the AFL coaches. I'm sure if you asked any SANFL coach they would love for all their players to give a little more each week.

He won't be playing against mainly afl players. He will be playing against mainly duds.

tigerpie wrote:

daysofourlives wrote:I'v heard Collingwood and Carlton are sitting back with a wait and see approach with how the SANFL goes this year.
If it can maintain a similar standard to previous years they are more than keen to enter their reserves team in the SANFL as they see it as being much stronger than the VFL, They are probably the only clubs with the resources to be able to do it financially.

Thats the most outlandish crock of excrement ive ever heard.

You don't think they can afford it??

valleys07 wrote:Not having a crack at anybody in particular, but what argument will it be? One minute the 2 AFL sides wont give a rats toss about winning, but another post highlights the supposed advantage both will have.

But both can be true. The Sydney Swans reserves, for example, have a mammoth advantage in facilities, coaches, and (in the context of the NSW/ACT comp) talent over their competitors. So much so that the comp administrators have had to game the system with caps on AFL-listed players etc, in order to minimise the lopsided results. But at the same time, Belconnen FC and their ilk will bust a gut to win a game or get the premiership—doing so is the principal reason for their existence. Whereas for the Swans reserves, winning a flag in Canberra is nice, but it isn't the be-all and end-all as long as the kids develop and learn the game plan.

The mandatory leave period under the AFLPA's enterprise bargaining agreement is just one of the reasons why AFL reserves sides tend to tail off in the finals—the sooner you can get your kids off the park and on holidays, the sooner you can start pre-season training for next year.

valleys07 wrote:Either way port and adelaide will be critiqued regardless of ladder position.

They'll be critiqued regardless of ladder position quite validly. The Crows reserves finishing top, bottom or in the middle in 2014 won't validate the decision. Because the valid criticism isn't "they'll be way too strong for this comp", or "they'll be way too weak for this comp". It's, "they don't belong in this comp at all—it is a SA state football league for clubs to pit their best players against each other. They are not a SA state football league club, and they are not pitting their best players against their opponents". The situation with Port is a bit more complex in 2014, but by 2015 they will have fully adopted the 'soulless franchise reserves team' model, and so will be equally undeserving of a spot in the comp.

RB wrote:I doubt the Crows and Power Reserves players will feel losses in the same way as players on the proper teams will.

How the hell can you think that? These blokes are as competitive as any other footballer playing in any competition anywhere and will cross that line wanting to win. If you think they are purely in "development mode" on a Saturday afternoon......

Every player, well mostly, goes out there to beat their direct opponent. No doubt!

SimonH wrote:

valleys07 wrote:Not having a crack at anybody in particular, but what argument will it be? One minute the 2 AFL sides wont give a rats toss about winning, but another post highlights the supposed advantage both will have.

But both can be true. The Sydney Swans reserves, for example, have a mammoth advantage in facilities, coaches, and (in the context of the NSW/ACT comp) talent over their competitors. So much so that the comp administrators have had to game the system with caps on AFL-listed players etc, in order to minimise the lopsided results. But at the same time, Belconnen FC and their ilk will bust a gut to win a game or get the premiership—doing so is the principal reason for their existence. Whereas for the Swans reserves, winning a flag in Canberra is nice, but it isn't the be-all and end-all as long as the kids develop and learn the game plan.

The mandatory leave period under the AFLPA's enterprise bargaining agreement is just one of the reasons why AFL reserves sides tend to tail off in the finals—the sooner you can get your kids off the park and on holidays, the sooner you can start pre-season training for next year.

valleys07 wrote:Either way port and adelaide will be critiqued regardless of ladder position.

They'll be critiqued regardless of ladder position quite validly. The Crows reserves finishing top, bottom or in the middle in 2014 won't validate the decision. Because the valid criticism isn't "they'll be way too strong for this comp", or "they'll be way too weak for this comp". It's, "they don't belong in this comp at all—it is a SA state football league for clubs to pit their best players against each other. They are not a SA state football league club, and they are not pitting their best players against their opponents". The situation with Port is a bit more complex in 2014, but by 2015 they will have fully adopted the 'soulless franchise reserves team' model, and so will be equally undeserving of a spot in the comp.

First of all, the PAFC haven't "adopted" the 2015 model, they've had it forced upon them. But in 2015 they'll still have a club structure consisting of an AFL side, an SANFL League side, an SANFL Reserves side and a junior academy to enhance the development of young footballers.

It'll be the coaches of the AFL Reserves teams who will be the ones that wont care as much about winning. Their sole purpose it to have the players playing the game plan as perfectly as possible so when they get the call up they slot right into the AFL side and know where to be and what to do on the field.

How do you know how Buddha Hocking or the ravens coach feel about losing?

beenreal wrote:First of all, the PAFC haven't "adopted" the 2015 model, they've had it forced upon them. But in 2015 they'll still have a club structure consisting of an AFL side, an SANFL League side, an SANFL Reserves side and a junior academy to enhance the development of young footballers.

If Port had had anything forced upon it then it would be operating under the same model as the Crows. Through accomodating Port's desire for a structure below SANFL league ranks, the SANFL clubs surrendered their earlier desire that both pseudoteams adhere to the same model.

But by all means, continue to believe that the SANFL forced Port into this against its wishes. That will give you something besides your own club to point the finger at when it all goes pear-shaped in a few years' time. You've done it for the last 17 years; why change now?