Structure of cricket in SA

[auto]

Have been discussing this in our churches cricket forum. Para Districts and Adelaide Suburban are going pretty good by all reports, Churches and Great Southern not so good. Turf cricket has its place. District cricket IMO has way too many clubs (just my opinion) and hasnt produced enough state cricketers. So if you had a clean slate what would your structure of cricket in SA look like ???

[aceman]

Have been discussing this in our churches cricket forum. Para Districts and Adelaide Suburban are going pretty good by all reports, Churches and Great Southern not so good. Turf cricket has its place. District cricket IMO has way too many clubs (just my opinion) and hasnt produced enough state cricketers. So if you had a clean slate what would your structure of cricket in SA look like ???

You are correct with that statement and for years there has been on offer from SACA a huge incentive for clubs to amalgamate. The comp should be no more than 10 teams IMO and University not having any juniors should be one of the first out.
There was talk a few years ago about Port Adelaide and their issues, it appears now that Prospect have similar problems. Ideally Port & Woodville or West Torrens join forces, become the Western Districts and what a powerhouse that should become................but noone will take up the offer so maybe one day SACA, the 'toothless tiger' will enforce it onto a couple of clubs but having a bye is crap and 13 teams is too many.

[sherminator]

Have been discussing this in our churches cricket forum. Para Districts and Adelaide Suburban are going pretty good by all reports, Churches and Great Southern not so good. Turf cricket has its place. District cricket IMO has way too many clubs (just my opinion) and hasnt produced enough state cricketers. So if you had a clean slate what would your structure of cricket in SA look like ???

Did you mean Southern there Auto? I have been reading the other thread and the proposal of turning all metro hard wicket comps into one seems plausible but unlikely. We as humans are not too big on change regardless of the potential benefits!

As for grade cricket, you've made a very good point. SA seem to be relying on interstate recruits for the Shield side so anything that will strengthen local cricket should be encouraged. I vaguely remember SACA trying to start a second league based on zones some years ago where the best players from the comp were split into North, South, East & West?

[bulldogproud2]

Hi Sherminator,
The East, West, North, South concept was just basically trials for the Redback squad. Matches were held before the season proper got underway. It really had nothing to do with District Cricket per se.
Not sure about the idea floated by another contributor about Port merging with either Woodville or West Torrens. Woodville and West Torrens have won three of the last four premierships. Not sure that either of these clubs would like the idea of merging. Prospect and Port Adelaide may be a more suitable merger.
Cheers

[Executive Member]

I think should be 8
but if you split 12 into 2 divisions of 6 with premiers only being promoted from Div 2 each year and bottom Div relegated

Potential State Players if in a Div 2 side would soon move to a Div 1 side

Seems to me too many average players playing District cricket, which is the reason some of our State Players can score 100's each week but then are exposed in State Cricket

Less sides equals more competition

Australian cricket is strong - they only have 6 sides to choose players from

My thoughts anyway

[aceman]

Hi Sherminator,
The East, West, North, South concept was just basically trials for the Redback squad. Matches were held before the season proper got underway. It really had nothing to do with District Cricket per se.
Not sure about the idea floated by another contributor about Port merging with either Woodville or West Torrens. Woodville and West Torrens have won three of the last four premierships. Not sure that either of these clubs would like the idea of merging. Prospect and Port Adelaide may be a more suitable merger.Cheers

Both clubs would need to not only pull their fingers out but get some people involved who are living in the 21st century. Prospect has been on the skids for a while now and is getting worse every season. New people with new ideas to attract new enthusiasm, not the same blokes who have been staid all of their life rehashing stale ideas.

[Goat Herder]

Spot on Executive Member, there are definitely too many teams in Grade cricket and the talent is diluted. Greg Chappell had it right when he was cricketing director (or whatever the position was called that he held with the SACA? ) in recommending a concentration of clubs according to zone. It effectively strengthens all grades and the best play against the best in A Grade and develop accordingly. It goes without saying that if you smack a ton in A Grade against an attack that contains players who otherwise should be playing B Grade as per their cricketing ability, you'll struggle when you come up against a Shield attack. A blueprint comp of this nature has to happen if the SACA are serious about improving our on-field performances in all forms, especially the 4 day format.

As for an amalgamation of all metro hard wicket comps, it will be demographically impossible. Not sure what the answer is.

[Iron Fist]

I agree that there are to many clubs.
The most logical side to give the flick would be University as no juniors, like someone else said.

Port were in the dumps a few years back but have worked hard to get back and play some ok cricket. They are a few years from being a very good side IMO.
Prospect are struggling similar to how port was years ago. Think you can probably put East Torrens in the same category aswell.

No club will wilingly merge so it would have to be forced by SACA.

what could they come up with possibly??

Woodville West torrens (name says who merges)
Port Pirates (port and prospect)
Prospect Reds (prospect and east torrens)
Prospect Blacks (prospect and uni)
Western Warriors (port, woodville and West Torrens)

any more ideas???

[auto]

Spot on Executive Member, there are definitely too many teams in Grade cricket and the talent is diluted. Greg Chappell had it right when he was cricketing director (or whatever the position was called that he held with the SACA? ) in recommending a concentration of clubs according to zone. It effectively strengthens all grades and the best play against the best in A Grade and develop accordingly. It goes without saying that if you smack a ton in A Grade against an attack that contains players who otherwise should be playing B Grade as per their cricketing ability, you'll struggle when you come up against a Shield attack. A blueprint comp of this nature has to happen if the SACA are serious about improving our on-field performances in all forms, especially the 4 day format.

As for an amalgamation of all metro hard wicket comps, it will be demographically impossible. Not sure what the answer is.

As Pauline Hanson would say, "Please Explain".

[heater31]

I agree that there are to many clubs.
The most logical side to give the flick would be University as no juniors, like someone else said.

Port were in the dumps a few years back but have worked hard to get back and play some ok cricket. They are a few years from being a very good side IMO.
Prospect are struggling similar to how port was years ago. Think you can probably put East Torrens in the same category aswell.

No club will wilingly merge so it would have to be forced by SACA.

what could they come up with possibly??

Woodville West torrens (name says who merges)
Port Pirates (port and prospect)
Prospect Reds (prospect and east torrens)
Prospect Blacks (prospect and uni)
Western Warriors (port, woodville and West Torrens)

any more ideas???

How about the SACA put some strict criteria that must be met? All clubs must demonstate how they must achieve this.
If they don't meet them then they are sent to the ATCA.

then each club is able to continue in their own right and keep all their history in tact

[Goat Herder]

Spot on Executive Member, there are definitely too many teams in Grade cricket and the talent is diluted. Greg Chappell had it right when he was cricketing director (or whatever the position was called that he held with the SACA? ) in recommending a concentration of clubs according to zone. It effectively strengthens all grades and the best play against the best in A Grade and develop accordingly. It goes without saying that if you smack a ton in A Grade against an attack that contains players who otherwise should be playing B Grade as per their cricketing ability, you'll struggle when you come up against a Shield attack. A blueprint comp of this nature has to happen if the SACA are serious about improving our on-field performances in all forms, especially the 4 day format.

As for an amalgamation of all metro hard wicket comps, it will be demographically impossible. Not sure what the answer is.

As Pauline Hanson would say, "Please Explain".

How happy do you think Angle Vale would be about playing away games against Kangarilla...???

[auto]

Well if the hard wickets comps were split in 2 (north and south) then the travel factor would be no different to amatuer football/soccer or most other sports.

[geppscrossrams]

As for an amalgamation of all metro hard wicket comps, it will be demographically impossible. Not sure what the answer is. [/quote]

As Pauline Hanson would say, "Please Explain".[/quote]

How happy do you think Angle Vale would be about playing away games against Kangarilla...??? [/quote]
Already happens in ATCA with the possibility of Trinity Old Scholars (based at Gawler) potentially travelling to Reynella

[Pidge]

As for an amalgamation of all metro hard wicket comps, it will be demographically impossible. Not sure what the answer is.

As Pauline Hanson would say, "Please Explain".[/quote]

How happy do you think Angle Vale would be about playing away games against Kangarilla...??? [/quote]
Already happens in ATCA with the possibility of Trinity Old Scholars (based at Gawker) potentially travelling to Reynella[/quote]

Same happens in Soccer. For example a team from Port Elliot play against teams from Adelaide. 1.5 to 2 hour drive there and back..

[Iron Fist]

I agree that there are to many clubs.
The most logical side to give the flick would be University as no juniors, like someone else said.

Port were in the dumps a few years back but have worked hard to get back and play some ok cricket. They are a few years from being a very good side IMO.
Prospect are struggling similar to how port was years ago. Think you can probably put East Torrens in the same category aswell.

No club will wilingly merge so it would have to be forced by SACA.

what could they come up with possibly??

Woodville West torrens (name says who merges)
Port Pirates (port and prospect)
Prospect Reds (prospect and east torrens)
Prospect Blacks (prospect and uni)
Western Warriors (port, woodville and West Torrens)

any more ideas???

How about the SACA put some strict criteria that must be met? All clubs must demonstate how they must achieve this.
If they don't meet them then they are sent to the ATCA.

then each club is able to continue in their own right and keep all their history in tact

I beileve that was put to Port Adelaide a few years back and they completed the task.
Something similar could be put to a few different sides I think.

[Goat Herder]

Spot on Iron Fist. Port Adelaide had a whole stack of KPI's to meet when Robbie Christensen was in charge and they managed to tick all the required boxes somehow. Prospect are almost a mirror image of where the Magpies were when those demands were requested of them by the SACA and the same thing should happen to the Pirates now. Embarrassing low scores that Prospect are racking up are almost identical to Port 5yrs prior. Tim Ludeman has been a massive inclusion for Port and Weeksy has been a solid competitior with bat'n ball for quite a while now at Grade level. The emergence of a few younger lads who've come through the juniors will stand the club in good stead. Good to see my ol' mate Paul Finnie in the head coaching job again this year.

@ Auto - we've also had in in C&CCA in the past, with Para Vista having to travel to Blackwood to play, so it's nothing new to our comp either, but an amalgamation of ALL metro hard wicket comps (as stated) would be near-on impossible - and guaranteed to be a massive failure. Agreed though, a north & south comp may work. Lots of water to go under a lot of bridges before we'd ever get to that situation being a possibility.

[aceman]

Spot on Iron Fist. Port Adelaide had a whole stack of KPI's to meet when Robbie Christensen was in charge and they managed to tick all the required boxes somehow. Prospect are almost a mirror image of where the Magpies were when those demands were requested of them by the SACA and the same thing should happen to the Pirates now. Embarrassing low scores that Prospect are racking up are almost identical to Port 5yrs prior. Tim Ludeman has been a massive inclusion for Port and Weeksy has been a solid competitior with bat'n ball for quite a while now at Grade level. The emergence of a few younger lads who've come through the juniors will stand the club in good stead. Good to see my ol' mate Paul Finnie in the head coaching job again this year.

@ Auto - we've also had in in C&CCA in the past, with Para Vista having to travel to Blackwood to play, so it's nothing new to our comp either, but an amalgamation of ALL metro hard wicket comps (as stated) would be near-on impossible - and guaranteed to be a massive failure. Agreed though, a north & south comp may work. Lots of water to go under a lot of bridges before we'd ever get to that situation being a possibility.

GH, as a former Prospect player, committee person & junior coach, I am seeing exactly what you are but I don't see anything other than SACA enforcing an amalgamation between at least the 2 worst performing teams somehow. Clubs will not accept the fact they are on the "skids" for whatever reason, noone likes to lose their identity but for Grade cricket to get back to a reasonable standard, hard calls must be made at the top.

[Goat Herder]

It's certainly tough aceman. The wheel turns eventually and as one Club gets their legs under them, another is there to replace them in the spotlight with tough times of their own. Agree wholeheartedly that the hard calls need to be made and have to come from the top. As you pointed out though, no Club wants to lose their identity and whether you call them mergers, takeovers or whatevers, there's always a compromise involved. Therein lies the problem. Pride and ego's will get in the way of negotiations between Clubs, therefore it's up to the SACA to dictate what is going to happen. Don't like it? Well, off to ATCA then.

The SACA have dodged around the issue for long enough now. It's well past time for some action - or continue to be the laughing stock of the domestic scene. It's a shame the money they spent on paying slogger imports in the KFC Big Bash weren't poured into restructuring Grade cricket and trying to prepare a few of our own home-grown talent to succeed at the next level.

[heater31]

I agree that there are to many clubs.
The most logical side to give the flick would be University as no juniors, like someone else said.

Port were in the dumps a few years back but have worked hard to get back and play some ok cricket. They are a few years from being a very good side IMO.
Prospect are struggling similar to how port was years ago. Think you can probably put East Torrens in the same category aswell.

No club will wilingly merge so it would have to be forced by SACA.

what could they come up with possibly??

Woodville West torrens (name says who merges)
Port Pirates (port and prospect)
Prospect Reds (prospect and east torrens)
Prospect Blacks (prospect and uni)
Western Warriors (port, woodville and West Torrens)

any more ideas???

How about the SACA put some strict criteria that must be met? All clubs must demonstate how they must achieve this.
If they don't meet them then they are sent to the ATCA.

then each club is able to continue in their own right and keep all their history in tact

I beileve that was put to Port Adelaide a few years back and they completed the task.
Something similar could be put to a few different sides I think.

But putting this on only one club is not enough the whole comp as a whole must be put on notice and told to work.

The hard word needs to be placed on the 13 clubs by saying from year X there is only room for 8 clubs and each club must put forward a bid much like how the A League was structured or the Trans Tasman Netball. Only maybe 2 clubs in each sport only underwent minor changes to be a part of the new competition.

The clubs that miss out go into the A1 Premier Division and go forward as ATCA clubs not SACA clubs.

[smac]

Or SACA clubs should just concentrate on high performance/sub elite cricket. Forget the whites junior grades and forget C/D grade for starters.