The South Australian Political Landscape

[Dogwatcher]

Hansard. I occasionally peruse it.

[Jimmy_041]

Hansard. I occasionally peruse it.

This sometimes gets interesting if you are bored: http://www.courts.sa.gov.au/judgments/index.html

The Karen Williams judgement is up if you want to read it: http://www.courts.sa.gov.au/Judgments/L ... %20132.pdf

Bernie the perv's cases are all in there and they make interesting reading as well

[Grahaml]

We all know nothing happens against this government unless The Advertiser decides its going back it.
It wouldn't matter what the Opposition did.
With the amount of money the Govt spend with the Advertiser (and about to spend another $200k), he'd have to commit murder

And Labor really hit the bottom of the $hit pit by wheeling out the pig Foley to poo poo the Royal Commissioner
http://indaily.com.au/news/local/2016/0 ... on-regime/

I think people are giving the opposition a raw deal. They don't decide what goes on radio, TV or in print. Marshall I'm sure manages to comment on all sorts of things, but in the final edit, most of it ends up cut. I think it's because people are more focussed on federal politics. Certainly I don't remember too many times they ran a story where they got a Turnbull comment without a Shorten comment following it. Certainly a much easier job being opposition leader federally when the media force you to reply every time.

But the liberal's inability to win government goes much deeper. I actually find it worrying, but of the last 7 state elections, 4 have seen the Libs win 2 party preferred and end up in opposition. 1 time in all those 7 elections, the ALP have won a majority on two party preferred. That's more than 30 years. The closest of those elections where the libs have gotten more votes and lost, it was 50.9 to 49.1. I would have thought any election with a party getting a majority of votes and not winning government would be embarrassing for the AEC. Anything more than 1% between the two and it should be seen as a failure. It's just a joke that the party the majority of South Australians vote for isn't the party we elect and the recent boundary changes were a start, but far from adequate.

53% is a resounding win in politics. Only 2 of the last 12 federal elections have had a bigger gap than that. They were still some 1.5% away from government. To put that into perspective, the 2PP they needed hasn't been achieved by any federal government since 1977. I'd argue that if the elections were a fair result of the way South Australians voted, then we wouldn't be talking about Marshall as ineffective, but talking about how effective he was.

[Jimmy_041]

A good indication of what you are saying Graham is how many people say Marshall just complains and is negative. Even Labor say it.
BUT, also, how many people ask "Where's Marshall? / Where's the opposition?"
How many times do we hear and outright lie (especially one Minister who is regularly caught) and the dumba$$ reporter doesn't even ask a question

I'm the last person to question a Supreme Court Judge but the Constitution is very clear and the proposed changes do not meet the criteria. They have tinkered around the edges again instead of completely redrawing the boundaries.
Privately, Labor people are equally amazed at the lack of proposed change.
On the current proposed basis; this will go to the Full Supreme Court

[Grahaml]

Politicians never want to be seen as complaining about things other than the other politicians. I've long felt the media need to be reined in. Not from a perspective of restricting criticism but to force them to be accurate and to respect people's privacy. They also won't make too much noise about this IMHO, because they don't want to be seen as whinging.

Foley came out the other day and tried to put a potential challenge in the whinge category by saying the liberals focussed too much on their own safe seats. Apparently, he seems to think that marginal seats are the only ones that matter and that some voters are more important than others. Very sad state of affairs if a former senior ALP politician feels that way, because it basically means our government feels that way.

[bennymacca]

Politicians never want to be seen as complaining about things other than the other politicians. I've long felt the media need to be reined in. Not from a perspective of restricting criticism but to force them to be accurate and to respect people's privacy. They also won't make too much noise about this IMHO, because they don't want to be seen as whinging.

Foley came out the other day and tried to put a potential challenge in the whinge category by saying the liberals focussed too much on their own safe seats. Apparently, he seems to think that marginal seats are the only ones that matter and that some voters are more important than others. Very sad state of affairs if a former senior ALP politician feels that way, because it basically means our government feels that way.

they are the only ones that matter when you are trying to form government though - rightly or wrongly. And that is why labor have done so whilst not having the majority of two party preferred.

[Grahaml]

It's wrong when it goes on each election. If the AEC changed the boundaries so that the majority vote wins like they're meant to each time, then I'd say fair play. But when it goes on and on, that's a clear failure by the AEC. 30 years of elections and the majority of the time the 2PP winner has been in opposition. The government governs for all of SA and I absolutely understand you can never guarantee it in our system, but it's the absolute basis of a democracy that whoever gets the most votes wins.

[bennymacca]

if the AEC redraws the boundaries so that it is 50-50 every time, but one side campaigns better every time, they will win those seats every time. I trust that they arent rigging it

[RB]

I don't recall the Libera Party complaining about the last redistribution in 2012. At any rate, if the swing had been uniform they would have won.

It's a system that has thrown up a couple of undesirable results but it's hard to think of a better one. The current system is at least based on 'fairness'. I know it hasn't worked out that way, but anything else would be arbitrary.

Besides some of the more senile Liberal members accusing the Electoral Commissioner of being corrupt, I haven't heard any suggestions for a different method.

[Grahaml]

I don't recall the Libera Party complaining about the last redistribution in 2012. At any rate, if the swing had been uniform they would have won.

It's a system that has thrown up a couple of undesirable results but it's hard to think of a better one. The current system is at least based on 'fairness'. I know it hasn't worked out that way, but anything else would be arbitrary.

Besides some of the more senile Liberal members accusing the Electoral Commissioner of being corrupt, I haven't heard any suggestions for a different method.

They wouldn't complain because they risk being seen as whingers. Foley has already put in a pre-emptive comment trying to make a possible challenge seem just that way.

The fairest system is to change the boundaries at each election to reflect a result more in line with the overall voting pattern. This is actually the system we're supposed to, but don't, have.

[RB]

Really though, that is the system we have: http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/sa/c ... 8/s83.html

They just haven't got it right the last couple of times.

[Jimmy_041]

Last couple of times?

[RB]

Three times since it was introduced, and two of those times conservative independents held the balance of power and for whatever reason went with Labor. Not the Commission's fault.

[Jimmy_041]

In 40 years, Labor has won the 2PP 3 times but governed for the vast majority (too late at night for me to get the stats)
So much for democracy in this state and no wonder we are are basket case in every respect
At least the Liberals had the decency to try to fix the gerrymander
This mob of ar$eholes will never want to change it as it will affect their ability to become millionaires on the public purse

[RB]

In 40 years, Labor has won the 2PP 3 times but governed for the vast majority (too late at night for me to get the stats)

Since the fairness provision was brought in in the early nineties, the Labor party have once won a majority of seats while winning a minority of the 2PP vote at a general election (2010). As I said, on two other occasions conservative independents have supported Labor - nothing to do with the system.

So much for democracy in this state and no wonder we are are basket case in every respect

Everyone gets to vote, and the system is at least designed to get a party who gets a majority of the 2PP in government (which it would have been if the conservative independents hadn't sided with Labor). There are a swathe of marginal seats that Labor held on to because the voters in those seats re-elected them - democracy isn't the issue here. I would describe the opposition as being the real basket case due to their candidate selection, leader and general inability to win close contests.

At least the Liberals had the decency to try to fix the gerrymander

After decades of not doing anything about it. Even then, the guy who fixed it was shafted by his own party in the end.

This mob of ar$eholes will never want to change it as it will affect their ability to become millionaires on the public purse

I don't generally comment on this thread because I don't wish to debate politics on the internet and I don't barrack for either side. But come on, self-interest is one thing, rigging elections is pretty big accusation! The more people and organizations are said to be involved in a conspiracy, the more fanciful the allegation of a conspiracy seems, IMO...

[Grahaml]

The AEC wouldn't be controlled by any party, but no doubt they can be influenced by comment as any organisation can. The Liberals, in my opinion, haven't made as much noise about it as they should and I think mostly because they fear a public backlash.

But the final washup is this. In 30 years, the party winning 2PP has ended up in opposition. As your link says, "sufficient numbers to form government". That goes against your idea of a couple of independants making all the difference. And with any result over 51% to one party, there should be a fairly significant number of seats between the parties. Last election was 53%.

[Jimmy_041]

The AEC wouldn't be controlled by any party, but no doubt they can be influenced by comment as any organisation can. The Liberals, in my opinion, haven't made as much noise about it as they should and I think mostly because they fear a public backlash.

But the final washup is this. In 30 years, the party winning 2PP has ended up in opposition. As your link says, "sufficient numbers to form government". That goes against your idea of a couple of independants making all the difference. And with any result over 51% to one party, there should be a fairly significant number of seats between the parties. Last election was 53%.

I think you'll find they will be pushing this all the way this time
As I said after the last election, it's heading towards the full Supreme Court to enforce s83 of the Constitution
Regardless of which side you barrack for, if that happens, the issue will be settled once and for all

[Booney]

Looking at March next year for the nRAH to be in use, at absolute best.

[stan]

Looking at March next year for the nRAH to be in use, at absolute best.

March 2017, what someone has put an actual month down.

Well shit hey.

[Booney]

Looking at March next year for the nRAH to be in use, at absolute best.

March 2017, what someone has put an actual month down.

Well shit hey.

Nope, I said at best.

Technical completion in mid September ( all going well ) and then minimum 3 months of system testing from there. ( Mid Dec at best ). All going ok with that testing and around New Year there should be signs of life, however, many of the systems to be tested are not yet finalized and as such the practical completion date and testing commencement date are not likely to be the same thing.