SA Footy

This "Spirit of the game" stuff is BS imho, the laws of the game should dictate the required spirit.

Same with Mankading (I know Im in the minority as I fully support it) - But how it can be condemned as poor sportsmanship but batsmen trying to get head starts on runs isn't, completely bemuses me.

Ultimately with that example and Bairstow's brain fart, be in your crease when you need to and run risks when you aren't. Simple stuff.

am Bays wrote:Big news

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/alex-carey-elevated-australia-song-master-under-southern-cross-bairstow-controversy-mccullum-sunak/2023-07-04

I've thought for a while Lyon would hand it down to Travis Head but he obviously had Carey lined up.

mal wrote:OK its time I set the record straight with Carey/Bairstow
England started it
1882 Australian cricketer Sammy Jones was batting in a EG V AU test match
Jones presumed the ball was dead , left his crease and was run out by W G Grace
England had a 4th innings chase of 85 to win
Fred The Demon Spofforth took 7/44 and England fell 7 runs short of the chase
The origin of the Ashes dates back to the match

Was it a big crowd there that day mAl? Did you get into a corporate box?

JK wrote:This "Spirit of the game" stuff is BS imho, the laws of the game should dictate the required spirit.

Same with Mankading (I know Im in the minority as I fully support it) - But how it can be condemned as poor sportsmanship but batsmen trying to get head starts on runs isn't, completely bemuses me.

Ultimately with that example and Bairstow's brain fart, be in your crease when you need to and run risks when you aren't. Simple stuff.

Mankading is the batter trying to gain an advantage but Bairstow was batting in his crease and thought it was over.
Any other team except the Poms I would have called the batter back.

amber_fluid wrote:

JK wrote:This "Spirit of the game" stuff is BS imho, the laws of the game should dictate the required spirit.

Same with Mankading (I know Im in the minority as I fully support it) - But how it can be condemned as poor sportsmanship but batsmen trying to get head starts on runs isn't, completely bemuses me.

Ultimately with that example and Bairstow's brain fart, be in your crease when you need to and run risks when you aren't. Simple stuff.

Mankading is the batter trying to gain an advantage but Bairstow was batting in his crease and thought it was over.
Any other team except the Poms I would have called the batter back.

If he'd been injured and wandered out of his crease I'd have brought him back but thats it. Not the ideal way to get a wicket I agree, but Bairstow was the ONLY player that could have ensured a dismissal was impossible.

JK wrote:

amber_fluid wrote:

JK wrote:This "Spirit of the game" stuff is BS imho, the laws of the game should dictate the required spirit.

Same with Mankading (I know Im in the minority as I fully support it) - But how it can be condemned as poor sportsmanship but batsmen trying to get head starts on runs isn't, completely bemuses me.

Ultimately with that example and Bairstow's brain fart, be in your crease when you need to and run risks when you aren't. Simple stuff.

Mankading is the batter trying to gain an advantage but Bairstow was batting in his crease and thought it was over.
Any other team except the Poms I would have called the batter back.

If he'd been injured and wandered out of his crease I'd have brought him back but thats it. Not the ideal way to get a wicket I agree, but Bairstow was the ONLY player that could have ensured a dismissal was impossible.

Either way it couldn’t have happened to a better bloke!

Yep, love the added spice. Nothing like the Ashes and perhaps a shame the commentary has been overshadowed by the controversial moments rather than the tight contests both teams have provided thus far. But, F*** the Poms

JK wrote:

amber_fluid wrote:

JK wrote:This "Spirit of the game" stuff is BS imho, the laws of the game should dictate the required spirit.

Same with Mankading (I know Im in the minority as I fully support it) - But how it can be condemned as poor sportsmanship but batsmen trying to get head starts on runs isn't, completely bemuses me.

Ultimately with that example and Bairstow's brain fart, be in your crease when you need to and run risks when you aren't. Simple stuff.

Mankading is the batter trying to gain an advantage but Bairstow was batting in his crease and thought it was over.
Any other team except the Poms I would have called the batter back.

If he'd been injured and wandered out of his crease I'd have brought him back but thats it. Not the ideal way to get a wicket I agree, but Bairstow was the ONLY player that could have ensured a dismissal was impossible.

Very unlucky way to get out
but so is getting caught down the leg side,
getting caught from a deflection from another player,
getting run out from a deflection from the bowler on his follow through,
getting run out by your batting partner without facing a ball,
do we call them back too?

If Carey was keeping up would he have left the crease?
No?
Why Not?
BECAUSE HE WOULD HAVE BEEN STUMPED.

gazzamagoo wrote:Very unlucky way to get out
but so is getting caught down the leg side,
getting caught from a deflection from another player,
getting run out from a deflection from the bowler on his follow through,
getting run out by your batting partner without facing a ball,
do we call them back too?

Exactly. The thing with this "spirit of cricket" argument is that in this case, it's just an argument. You can make arguments either way about whether the spirit of cricket, vague as it is, demanded that Cummins should withdraw the appeal. It's a grey area. Which is why the collective tantrum from the English team and its supporters is so silly.

I thought it was telling that Ben Stokes said that if he had been in Cummins' position, he would have to have a think about whether to withdraw the appeal. I mean, if it was so blatantly against the "spirit of cricket" - as many soap dodgers would have you believe - then presumably it wouldn't require any contemplation?

There are a million and one unlucky things that can happen to you on the cricket field, but this is hardly one of them. Bairstow realised that he'd let his team down by committing a brainfade.

Expecting the other side effectively to overturn the ump's call and give you a life might be understandable in an incredibly clear-cut case of an overly technical application of the Laws being contrary to the "spirit of cricket". But this ain't that.

gazzamagoo wrote:If Carey was keeping up would he have left the crease?
No?
Why Not?
BECAUSE HE WOULD HAVE BEEN STUMPED.

I have sympathy both ways here.
The fact he kept in the crease, scratched guard, then left leans me towards it being the wrong decision. If he ducked the bouncer, looked around and walked out to pressure a run, then fair game.

MW wrote:

gazzamagoo wrote:If Carey was keeping up would he have left the crease?
No?
Why Not?
BECAUSE HE WOULD HAVE BEEN STUMPED.

I have sympathy both ways here.
The fact he kept in the crease, scratched guard, then left leans me towards it being the wrong decision. If he ducked the bouncer, looked around and walked out to pressure a run, then fair game.

Completely agree if it's in the backyard with no umpires apart from Mum and Dad as independent third parties post the incident

But in a test match with professional umpires you stay in crease until until you hear "over" or as a minimum you know where the ball is.

Jonny **** up and has no excuse.

MW wrote:

gazzamagoo wrote:If Carey was keeping up would he have left the crease?
No?
Why Not?
BECAUSE HE WOULD HAVE BEEN STUMPED.

I have sympathy both ways here.
The fact he kept in the crease, scratched guard, then left leans me towards it being the wrong decision. If he ducked the bouncer, looked around and walked out to pressure a run, then fair game.

If you look closely, he actually taps the ground with his bat IMO effectively stating "crease" hence why he walked off.
He did it every time he went for a stroll
I watched him at the time and thought he had done the right thing by tapping the ground

On the Starc "catch", I was always taught dont let the ball go anywhere near the grass after you've caught it.
At the time, I thought he could be in trouble with what he did

But I dont, religiously, read the rules

Commonsense would say that the Starc catch should be out and the Bairstow stumping should be not out. The letter of the law says otherwise and I understand the 3rd umpire has to go by it. It wouldn't take much to adjust the laws to say otherwise. Starc clearly caught it in every way and he didn't use the ground to assist him in taking the catch. What is the difference between taking the ball two hands and throwing it in the air and taking the ball with two hands and shifting it to his left as he braced himself to hit the ground. The ball at no stage spilled or bobbled. Bairstow had ducked under the bouncer, already in his crease, marked his crease and walked out to do some gardening and meet his partner mid-pitch. Granted, he did it in Fast Forward. For me, commonsense says he's shouldn't be out for that.

However, it is all about context. The fact that Starc's catch was disallowed the evening before on a technicality. The fact that Bairstow had tried to do exactly the same thing on day 3 to Labuschagne and had also tried to get Head out when he almost walked out of his crease and said to Head he would've claimed his wicket. The arrogance of the English with this Bazball cult. The situation of the game and the series.

Carey did nothing sneaky. He caught the ball and immediately threw it, Bairstow still in his crease. Bairstow's habit of walking off quickly without consideration of what was happening behind him and Carey's skill to hit the stumps gave the 3rd umpire no choice. If Cummins withdraws the appeal, what does that do for team morale and how does that make Carey feel. I am glad Cummins stuck to his guns and am comfortable with how the Australians handled it. Don't give them an inch. I think the English are hypocritical and the way the crowd at the ground and in the long room acted was moronic. The Spirit of Cricket is a thing, but England, Stokes and McCullum haven't displayed that and calling Australia out on it is pretty pathetic.

Can't wait for Headingley.

Aerie wrote:Commonsense would say that the Starc catch should be out and the Bairstow stumping should be not out. The letter of the law says otherwise and I understand the 3rd umpire has to go by it. It wouldn't take much to adjust the laws to say otherwise. Starc clearly caught it in every way and he didn't use the ground to assist him in taking the catch. What is the difference between taking the ball two hands and throwing it in the air and taking the ball with two hands and shifting it to his left as he braced himself to hit the ground. The ball at no stage spilled or bobbled. Bairstow had ducked under the bouncer, already in his crease, marked his crease and walked out to do some gardening and meet his partner mid-pitch. Granted, he did it in Fast Forward. For me, commonsense says he's shouldn't be out for that.

However, it is all about context. The fact that Starc's catch was disallowed the evening before on a technicality. The fact that Bairstow had tried to do exactly the same thing on day 3 to Labuschagne and had also tried to get Head out when he almost walked out of his crease and said to Head he would've claimed his wicket. The arrogance of the English with this Bazball cult. The situation of the game and the series.

Carey did nothing sneaky. He caught the ball and immediately threw it, Bairstow still in his crease. Bairstow's habit of walking off quickly without consideration of what was happening behind him and Carey's skill to hit the stumps gave the 3rd umpire no choice. If Cummins withdraws the appeal, what does that do for team morale and how does that make Carey feel. I am glad Cummins stuck to his guns and am comfortable with how the Australians handled it. Don't give them an inch. I think the English are hypocritical and the way the crowd at the ground and in the long room acted was moronic. The Spirit of Cricket is a thing, but England, Stokes and McCullum haven't displayed that and calling Australia out on it is pretty pathetic.

Can't wait for Headingley.

The perfect retort, send this to the MCC.

gazzamagoo wrote:

Aerie wrote:Commonsense would say that the Starc catch should be out and the Bairstow stumping should be not out. The letter of the law says otherwise and I understand the 3rd umpire has to go by it. It wouldn't take much to adjust the laws to say otherwise. Starc clearly caught it in every way and he didn't use the ground to assist him in taking the catch. What is the difference between taking the ball two hands and throwing it in the air and taking the ball with two hands and shifting it to his left as he braced himself to hit the ground. The ball at no stage spilled or bobbled. Bairstow had ducked under the bouncer, already in his crease, marked his crease and walked out to do some gardening and meet his partner mid-pitch. Granted, he did it in Fast Forward. For me, commonsense says he's shouldn't be out for that.

However, it is all about context. The fact that Starc's catch was disallowed the evening before on a technicality. The fact that Bairstow had tried to do exactly the same thing on day 3 to Labuschagne and had also tried to get Head out when he almost walked out of his crease and said to Head he would've claimed his wicket. The arrogance of the English with this Bazball cult. The situation of the game and the series.

Carey did nothing sneaky. He caught the ball and immediately threw it, Bairstow still in his crease. Bairstow's habit of walking off quickly without consideration of what was happening behind him and Carey's skill to hit the stumps gave the 3rd umpire no choice. If Cummins withdraws the appeal, what does that do for team morale and how does that make Carey feel. I am glad Cummins stuck to his guns and am comfortable with how the Australians handled it. Don't give them an inch. I think the English are hypocritical and the way the crowd at the ground and in the long room acted was moronic. The Spirit of Cricket is a thing, but England, Stokes and McCullum haven't displayed that and calling Australia out on it is pretty pathetic.

Can't wait for Headingley.

The perfect retort, send this to the MCC.

Kinda disagree with Marnus comparison as he was actually batting out of his crease, but either way the way we are acting is absolutely ridiculous. Was clearly out and JB just had a brain fart, stop crying and focus on winning the game playing smarter cricket.

Aerie wrote:Commonsense would say that the Starc catch should be out and the Bairstow stumping should be not out. The letter of the law says otherwise and I understand the 3rd umpire has to go by it. It wouldn't take much to adjust the laws to say otherwise. Starc clearly caught it in every way and he didn't use the ground to assist him in taking the catch. What is the difference between taking the ball two hands and throwing it in the air and taking the ball with two hands and shifting it to his left as he braced himself to hit the ground. The ball at no stage spilled or bobbled. Bairstow had ducked under the bouncer, already in his crease, marked his crease and walked out to do some gardening and meet his partner mid-pitch. Granted, he did it in Fast Forward. For me, commonsense says he's shouldn't be out for that.

However, it is all about context. The fact that Starc's catch was disallowed the evening before on a technicality. The fact that Bairstow had tried to do exactly the same thing on day 3 to Labuschagne and had also tried to get Head out when he almost walked out of his crease and said to Head he would've claimed his wicket. The arrogance of the English with this Bazball cult. The situation of the game and the series.

Carey did nothing sneaky. He caught the ball and immediately threw it, Bairstow still in his crease. Bairstow's habit of walking off quickly without consideration of what was happening behind him and Carey's skill to hit the stumps gave the 3rd umpire no choice. If Cummins withdraws the appeal, what does that do for team morale and how does that make Carey feel. I am glad Cummins stuck to his guns and am comfortable with how the Australians handled it. Don't give them an inch. I think the English are hypocritical and the way the crowd at the ground and in the long room acted was moronic. The Spirit of Cricket is a thing, but England, Stokes and McCullum haven't displayed that and calling Australia out on it is pretty pathetic.

Can't wait for Headingley.

Great post!!

Still waiting for a response from Bairstow or have i missed it

spell_check wrote:https://www.news.com.au/sport/cricket/bloody-oath-i-would-travis-head-accuses-bairstow-of-ashes-hypocrisy/news-story/689e268def518f2706ee8e36dbd741e4

Wonder what Mr Stokes's would have done the previous week if Trav wasn't smarter than ol mate Jonny!