Essendon

[kickinit]

I listened to McDevitt today and things dont sound flash. I cant understand how he can offer 6 month bans for players who fess up, wouldnt think WADA would be happy with that. The most important thing he said though was that AOD9604 was deemed legal at the time and the players would escape any penalty from using it. The TB4 on the other hand sounds worrying

Handing out 6months bans to anyone coming forward is pretty smart. If they handed good enough evidence it could see the others that don't come forward have not hope in winning a appeal.

Thats the bit I dont get. If their evidence is as strong as they say it is wouldnt it be better to rub drug cheats out for 2 years?
Why give them an easy way out?

Think you'll find they have the evidence for use of the banned substance, what their after though is who was involved behind the scene's.

[cracka]

Because they know the club faarked up, not the players, but being ignorant isn't an excuse.

What about being lied to.

[dedja]

It's clear ASADA are sympathetic to the players, unfortunately regardless of them not knowing what was happening to them in terms of what was injected or ingested, it is ultimately the player (athlete) who must take the ultimate responsibility.

Image if this happened in cycling, and the cyclist claimed the same defence? I doubt many would be sympathetic.

It's a harsh world of compliance unfortunately, but I do really feel for the players and the Essendon Board and Hird should hang their heads in shame for putting the players last, both at the time of offending and now for trying to run away from the truth.

[Jim05]

It's clear ASADA are sympathetic to the players, unfortunately regardless of them not knowing what was happening to them in terms of what was injected or ingested, it is ultimately the player (athlete) who must take the ultimate responsibility.

Image if this happened in cycling, and the cyclist claimed the same defence? I doubt many would be sympathetic.

It's a harsh world of compliance unfortunately, but I do really feel for the players and the Essendon Board and Hird should hang their heads in shame for putting the players last, both at the time of offending and now for trying to run away from the truth.

I think therein lies the problem, im not sure anyone knows exactly was taken.
As long as the drug wasnt banned I dont care if players had 100 injections a day.
The AOD9604 has been confirmed as been legit at the time of use but still hasnt been tested enough and is now banned. The TB4 is the one ASADA are convicting on and the paper trail definately leads to Essendon and Dank having TB4 on premises, how many players took it is uncertain. The ammount of the drug traced to Essendon was only enough for half a dozen players according to reports but because 34 players signed consent forms to partake in the program they all will get infraction notices eventually.
It has been stated several times by ASADA that players can be suspended for intent of use so we may end up finding plenty of players get suspended despite not actually taking anything. I think that is why the players will fight hard because there are plenty of them that know they havnt taken anything illegal

[dedja]

It's really simple, Essendon have to stop hiding and dodging and co-operate otherwise their whole club will be decimated.

How their Board is still there is beyond me.

The AFL have every right to take away their licence or revisit their sanctions for bringing the game into further disrepute.

[Jim05]

It's really simple, Essendon have to stop hiding and dodging and co-operate otherwise their whole club will be decimated.

How their Board is still there is beyond me.

The AFL have every right to take away their licence or revisit their sanctions for bringing the game into further disrepute.

I think they have co-operated a fair bit unlike Cronulla who has refused to let their players even be questioned.
Its also nearly an entirely differant board than the one that was around in 2012.
If the club/players feel they are innocent why shouldnt they fight?
The players all have their own legal teams and are free to take the 6 month deal if they choose yet as of yet none have. The club is not privy to any of the information on the individual show cause notices. Guys like Lonergen and Reimers who were dumped and have a massive grudge against the club are willing to fight rather than cop 6 months even though they risk 2 years so they obviously believe they are innocent.
I do agree this latest stuff of trying to get the investigation thrown out wont stick and even if it does they will just start again. As for the major people involved I hope they get their fair whack if we are proven guilty

[Red Rocket]

As much as I hate the Bombers and hope they get rubbed out I have no issue with them taking it further if they feel they are innocent.
Screw them if they are trying to stall or are lying but everyone is allowed natural justice and should be able to fight their charges.

[cracka]

It's clear ASADA are sympathetic to the players, unfortunately regardless of them not knowing what was happening to them in terms of what was injected or ingested, it is ultimately the player (athlete) who must take the ultimate responsibility.

Image if this happened in cycling, and the cyclist claimed the same defence? I doubt many would be sympathetic.

It's a harsh world of compliance unfortunately, but I do really feel for the players and the Essendon Board and Hird should hang their heads in shame for putting the players last, both at the time of offending and now for trying to run away from the truth.

Shouldn't compare cycling to AFL on a drugs issue as cycling is the biggest drug cheating sport going around. Plus the cyclists themselves are the ones doing the injecting etc. No players have tested positive for any banned substances, yes I know neither did Lance Armstrong but he knew he was taking banned substances & was trying to get away with it. I don't believe the Essendon players knew what they were taking & have been lied to by someone who should know.

[Q.]

Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

[Jim05]

Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

Cant compare them.
Saad tested positive, as yet there still isnt proof the Essendon players took anything illegal. Not to say any new info may provide proof though

[Jim05]

Season over it already wasnt.
How AFL footballers can miss so many set shots from so close beggars belief. Club has about 15 players not up to it, unfortunately we dont have much in the ressies so its going to be a long few years

[stan]

It's clear ASADA are sympathetic to the players, unfortunately regardless of them not knowing what was happening to them in terms of what was injected or ingested, it is ultimately the player (athlete) who must take the ultimate responsibility.

Image if this happened in cycling, and the cyclist claimed the same defence? I doubt many would be sympathetic.

It's a harsh world of compliance unfortunately, but I do really feel for the players and the Essendon Board and Hird should hang their heads in shame for putting the players last, both at the time of offending and now for trying to run away from the truth.

I think therein lies the problem, im not sure anyone knows exactly was taken.
As long as the drug wasnt banned I dont care if players had 100 injections a day.
The AOD9604 has been confirmed as been legit at the time of use but still hasnt been tested enough and is now banned. The TB4 is the one ASADA are convicting on and the paper trail definately leads to Essendon and Dank having TB4 on premises, how many players took it is uncertain. The ammount of the drug traced to Essendon was only enough for half a dozen players according to reports but because 34 players signed consent forms to partake in the program they all will get infraction notices eventually.
It has been stated several times by ASADA that players can be suspended for intent of use so we may end up finding plenty of players get suspended despite not actually taking anything. I think that is why the players will fight hard because there are plenty of them that know they havnt taken anything illegal

Jim, part of the problem is that nobody fully knew what the players were given. That is an absolute disgrace, these players are young men not test rats.

Perhaps thats what has been lost in all of this. I really feel the players need independent legal advice and not be apart of the Essendon - Little - Hird ego fight against the world.

I am all for the players fighting this but for the players the right way. I would suggest they speak to their managers and then get independent legal advice.

[Jim05]

It's clear ASADA are sympathetic to the players, unfortunately regardless of them not knowing what was happening to them in terms of what was injected or ingested, it is ultimately the player (athlete) who must take the ultimate responsibility.

Image if this happened in cycling, and the cyclist claimed the same defence? I doubt many would be sympathetic.

It's a harsh world of compliance unfortunately, but I do really feel for the players and the Essendon Board and Hird should hang their heads in shame for putting the players last, both at the time of offending and now for trying to run away from the truth.

I think therein lies the problem, im not sure anyone knows exactly was taken.
As long as the drug wasnt banned I dont care if players had 100 injections a day.
The AOD9604 has been confirmed as been legit at the time of use but still hasnt been tested enough and is now banned. The TB4 is the one ASADA are convicting on and the paper trail definately leads to Essendon and Dank having TB4 on premises, how many players took it is uncertain. The ammount of the drug traced to Essendon was only enough for half a dozen players according to reports but because 34 players signed consent forms to partake in the program they all will get infraction notices eventually.
It has been stated several times by ASADA that players can be suspended for intent of use so we may end up finding plenty of players get suspended despite not actually taking anything. I think that is why the players will fight hard because there are plenty of them that know they havnt taken anything illegal

Jim, part of the problem is that nobody fully knew what the players were given. That is an absolute disgrace, these players are young men not test rats.

Perhaps thats what has been lost in all of this. I really feel the players need independent legal advice and not be apart of the Essendon - Little - Hird ego fight against the world.

I am all for the players fighting this but for the players the right way. I would suggest they speak to their managers and then get independent legal advice.

The players all do have independant legal advice if they choose. The players will all be treated seperately to the club. Its believed some players are already talking to ASADA

[heater31]

Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

Cant compare them.
Saad tested positive, as yet there still isnt proof the Essendon players took anything illegal. Not to say any new info may provide proof though

Wade Lees a VFL footballer never took anything banned nor did he test positive. Only purchased a product with a banned substance in it. Who is to say that he was going to take it anyway could have investigated the label and then threw it in the bin.

Essendon players signed consent forms and ASADA think they have enough evidence of banned substances in their possession so they are in strife. Take the rumoured 6 months and be done with it IMO....

[Jim05]

Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

Cant compare them.
Saad tested positive, as yet there still isnt proof the Essendon players took anything illegal. Not to say any new info may provide proof though

Wade Lees a VFL footballer never took anything banned nor did he test positive. Only purchased a product with a banned substance in it. Who is to say that he was going to take it anyway could have investigated the label and then threw it in the bin.

Essendon players signed consent forms and ASADA think they have enough evidence of banned substances in their possession so they are in strife. Take the rumoured 6 months and be done with it IMO....

The players have the choice. As yet none have taken the deal but I think its only a matter of time before a couple do and then it may be a mad rush
Gus is the guy who I feel for most, finally gone to a side that will go deep into finals and he will be missing

[stan]

Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

Cant compare them.
Saad tested positive, as yet there still isnt proof the Essendon players took anything illegal. Not to say any new info may provide proof though

Wade Lees a VFL footballer never took anything banned nor did he test positive. Only purchased a product with a banned substance in it. Who is to say that he was going to take it anyway could have investigated the label and then threw it in the bin.

Essendon players signed consent forms and ASADA think they have enough evidence of banned substances in their possession so they are in strife. Take the rumoured 6 months and be done with it IMO....

The players have the choice. As yet none have taken the deal but I think its only a matter of time before a couple do and then it may be a mad rush
Gus is the guy who I feel for most, finally gone to a side that will go deep into finals and he will be missing

I would have thought Gus would be talking to ASADA now. If one was going to go first it would be him.

[Jim05]

[quote="Q."]Saad didn't know he was ingesting a banned substance either. Ignorance has never been a good excuse.

Cant compare them.
Saad tested positive, as yet there still isnt proof the Essendon players took anything illegal. Not to say any new info may provide proof though

Wade Lees a VFL footballer never took anything banned nor did he test positive. Only purchased a product with a banned substance in it. Who is to say that he was going to take it anyway could have investigated the label and then threw it in the bin.

Essendon players signed consent forms and ASADA think they have enough evidence of banned substances in their possession so they are in strife. Take the rumoured 6 months and be done with it IMO....

The players have the choice. As yet none have taken the deal but I think its only a matter of time before a couple do and then it may be a mad rush
Gus is the guy who I feel for most, finally gone to a side that will go deep into finals and he will be missing

I would have thought Gus would be talking to ASADA now. If one was going to go first it would be him.[/quote]

Difficult one, if he takes the 6 months the ban is effective immediately and his misses finals, maybe he hopes it drags out in court until the season is over or maybe he believes he is innocent and wants to fight it. Time will tell

[Frosty]

Won't they all just stretch it out until September - take the 6 months and be back on the park ready for season 2015 in April next year.

I'm sure someone will organise ad hoc trainings to keep them semi-fit over the break.

They'll start slowly next year but by mid year they'll be up and about and fresher than the other teams in the comp.

[heater31]

I'm sure someone will organise ad hoc trainings to keep them semi-fit over the break.

They will have to train by themselves as they won't be allowed to train as a group.

[Frosty]

You really think they won't all turn up accidentally to St Kilda beach at the same time for quick dip in the ocean?