The South Australian Political Landscape

Labor, Liberal, Greens, Democrats? Here's the place to discuss.

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Dec 07, 2023 2:05 pm

dedja wrote:SA Health has been in crisis for a long time now, and unfortunately we're not the only state with issues.

It's already past the point where State Governments can fund their health systems to an appropriate level, but long term State Government incompetency hasn't helped! #-o

Considering that Labor have been in power here for the majority of the last 50 years, they need to cop the appropriate criticism.

There's always efficiencies that can be found but it's seems obvious that we need to spend more in a smarter way.

With an ageing population, it's only going to get worse.


More ambulances and shiny new HQs were never the proper solution but they served three political purposes:
1. Pay back Ash and her mates for election campaign
2. Ambulances can still attend despite massive ramping still happens.
3. Pay back Ash and her mates for election campaign

But putting on more ambulances is like turning up the tap when the hose nozzle is blocked.

The critics of Transforming Health, and of the NRAH being too small, are sitting now saying "told you so"
User avatar
Jimmy_041
Coach
 
 
Posts: 14001
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:30 pm
Has liked: 720 times
Been liked: 1072 times
Grassroots Team: Prince Alfred OC

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby dedja » Thu Dec 07, 2023 2:10 pm

As you know, Labor can get away with it because the Libs are absolutely hopeless, plus they are masters of managing marginal seats to get over the line.

They lasted 16 years last time when they were cooked after 8.
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt
User avatar
dedja
Coach
 
 
Posts: 20253
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:10 pm
Has liked: 178 times
Been liked: 996 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby stan » Fri Dec 08, 2023 6:57 am

It's astonishing how badly backwards they have gone on this issue.

Ramping was ******* terrible under the Libs, and now Pete had time to sort this out and treat the issue and the problem not the symptoms and he has made no progress.

David Spiers needs to get out front and centre and beat the drums here. It seems to be only the Libs social media pages hitting this and it's a massive hammer for the Libs to smash Pete with.

Vincent Tarzia has been up and about abit, I actually don't mind him as he's the member for my electorate and I rate the work he does for the local area.
Last edited by stan on Fri Dec 08, 2023 7:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Read my reply. It is directed at you because you have double standards
User avatar
stan
Coach
 
 
Posts: 15240
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 8:53 am
Location: North Eastern Suburbs
Has liked: 88 times
Been liked: 1254 times
Grassroots Team: Goodwood Saints

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby stan » Fri Dec 08, 2023 6:59 am

dedja wrote:As you know, Labor can get away with it because the Libs are absolutely hopeless, plus they are masters of managing marginal seats to get over the line.

They lasted 16 years last time when they were cooked after 8.
And here lies our problem, much like Victoria and WA but actually not quite as bad but still fairly useless on this.
Read my reply. It is directed at you because you have double standards
User avatar
stan
Coach
 
 
Posts: 15240
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 8:53 am
Location: North Eastern Suburbs
Has liked: 88 times
Been liked: 1254 times
Grassroots Team: Goodwood Saints

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jim05 » Fri Dec 08, 2023 7:03 am

stan wrote:
dedja wrote:As you know, Labor can get away with it because the Libs are absolutely hopeless, plus they are masters of managing marginal seats to get over the line.

They lasted 16 years last time when they were cooked after 8.
And here lies our problem, much like Victoria and WA but actually not quite as bad but still fairly useless on this.
Too busy praying to Geebus or whatever fictional fairytale character they believe in
Jim05
Coach
 
 
Posts: 47130
Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2010 9:03 pm
Has liked: 1126 times
Been liked: 3553 times
Grassroots Team: South Gawler

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby dedja » Fri Dec 08, 2023 10:51 am

The problem with politics has been years in the making, and isn’t confined to State or even Federal political parties, it’s manifested itself throughout democratic countries. SA has some unique quirks though.

There are few politicians will real conviction anymore; popularism is king.

Shit, I despised a lot of Howard’s policies, but at least he had some conviction. Same for Hawke, Keating and Whitlam. Fraser seemed to have that quality after he left parliament. We’ve had muppets since.

In SA, you had Hall and Dunstan. Imagine any political party today who could only get re-elected by virtue of an obscene gerrymander, but then have a leader who instigated reforms to remove it. That’s what Steele Hall did.

As we moved from the 70’s into the 80’s, there was the blip called David Tonkin, then the Bannon years. Yes, it ended in disaster, be he was unassuming and also someone of substance. Arnold was given the ruins and had no hope of holding power, so the longest period of Liberals in power began (since Playford), lasting just over 8 years. Brown was a genuine and decent leader, but rolled by the entitled Olsen, who was targeted from within and eventually self imploded. Kerin then picked up the mess to run it out until the Rann, and then Weatherill years.

This is where Labor honed their ‘electoral maximisation skills’. They skilfully targeted marginal seats at the expense of all the safe seats to cling onto power for 16 long years. Rann was a Dunstan wanna be, and Weatherill was just an opportunist.

What did the Liberals do during these 16 long years? Court the electorate? Provide a serious alternative? Nope, they spent most of their energy on a civil war that started in the 60’s. 2 generations of Halls, Chapmans, Evans, then throw in a Wilson and DeGaris, formed the basis of the warring factions. The ashes of these wars are still smouldering today.

Marshall was the Liberal’s attempt to move on from the factions, but he was hopeless, and an easy prey from a well oiled Labor electoral machine. Enter Malinauskas, a genuine popularist who cleverly touted his youth. Having his rig displayed for all at a pool certain helped.

The Liberals are trying to move on from all that past, but have no idea how to do it. Labor, if there is anything you can say about them, are disciplined and are a machine when it comes to engaging in electoral warfare. I’m not sure the next Liberal Premier is even in parliament yet.

So, in my opinion, this is why you have what you have today in SA politics, and it’s depressing.
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt
User avatar
dedja
Coach
 
 
Posts: 20253
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:10 pm
Has liked: 178 times
Been liked: 996 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Fri Dec 08, 2023 11:51 am

dedja wrote:The problem with politics has been years in the making, and isn’t confined to State or even Federal political parties, it’s manifested itself throughout democratic countries. SA has some unique quirks though.

There are few politicians will real conviction anymore; popularism is king.

Shit, I despised a lot of Howard’s policies, but at least he had some conviction. Same for Hawke, Keating and Whitlam. Fraser seemed to have that quality after he left parliament. We’ve had muppets since.

In SA, you had Hall and Dunstan. Imagine any political party today who could only get re-elected by virtue of an obscene gerrymander, but then have a leader who instigated reforms to remove it. That’s what Steele Hall did.

As we moved from the 70’s into the 80’s, there was the blip called David Tonkin, then the Bannon years. Yes, it ended in disaster, be he was unassuming and also someone of substance. Arnold was given the ruins and had no hope of holding power, so the longest period of Liberals in power began (since Playford), lasting just over 8 years. Brown was a genuine and decent leader, but rolled by the entitled Olsen, who was targeted from within and eventually self imploded. Kerin then picked up the mess to run it out until the Rann, and then Weatherill years.

This is where Labor honed their ‘electoral maximisation skills’. They skilfully targeted marginal seats at the expense of all the safe seats to cling onto power for 16 long years. Rann was a Dunstan wanna be, and Weatherill was just an opportunist.

What did the Liberals do during these 16 long years? Court the electorate? Provide a serious alternative? Nope, they spent most of their energy on a civil war that started in the 60’s. 2 generations of Halls, Chapmans, Evans, then throw in a Wilson and DeGaris, formed the basis of the warring factions. The ashes of these wars are still smouldering today.

Marshall was the Liberal’s attempt to move on from the factions, but he was hopeless, and an easy prey from a well oiled Labor electoral machine. Enter Malinauskas, a genuine popularist who cleverly touted his youth. Having his rig displayed for all at a pool certain helped.

The Liberals are trying to move on from all that past, but have no idea how to do it. Labor, if there is anything you can say about them, are disciplined and are a machine when it comes to engaging in electoral warfare. I’m not sure the next Liberal Premier is even in parliament yet.

So, in my opinion, this is why you have what you have today in SA politics, and it’s depressing.


A very good summary other than the Labor gerrymander during the Rann / Weatherill years which Labor blamed on Steele Hall!
I know Labor thought Marshall would get a 2nd term due to the pandemic but the people suddenly turned against him because they wanted the government to take charge back again.

Then add in the worst election campaign in history. J. Christ Esq wouldn't have got elected on that campaign. Labor's campaign was targeted and effective despite the mis / disinformation which the Liberals were totally ineffective in countering. They thought they were going to romp it in
User avatar
Jimmy_041
Coach
 
 
Posts: 14001
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:30 pm
Has liked: 720 times
Been liked: 1072 times
Grassroots Team: Prince Alfred OC

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby dedja » Fri Dec 08, 2023 12:13 pm

Yes, the so called Labor gerrymander. It was, and still is, Labor’s ability to manage marginal seats that got them through, and when you do it that way, the 2 party preferred stats get out of whack.

We have an independent electoral commission that redraws boundaries in an attempt to make them as fair as possible but Labor were and are still able to work around that.

I think the next question is whether our system of preferential voting has serviced us well, and I honestly don’t know the answer, or rather, don’t know what system is best to replace it.

I wouldn’t be looking to Tasmania or New Zealand for answers.
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt
User avatar
dedja
Coach
 
 
Posts: 20253
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:10 pm
Has liked: 178 times
Been liked: 996 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby RB » Fri Dec 08, 2023 12:39 pm

dedja wrote:Yes, the so called Labor gerrymander. It was, and still is, Labor’s ability to manage marginal seats that got them through, and when you do it that way, the 2 party preferred stats get out of whack.

We have an independent electoral commission that redraws boundaries in an attempt to make them as fair as possible but Labor were and are still able to work around that.


Jimmy and I actually had this discussion in your absence, dedja (see link below). As you say, it was Labor's superiority (or the Liberals' incompetence?) in marginal seat campaigns which kept delivering Labor government, rather than 'gerrymandering', noting that an independent commission sets the boundaries well ahead of the election, all parties have the ability to challenge their decision, and Labor essentially tries for a majority of seats, by focusing on the key ones, rather than trying for a statewide 2PP majority, as soon as the 'starter's gun' is fired (i.e. the boundaries are set).

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=31005&start=2420

dedja wrote:I think the next question is whether our system of preferential voting has serviced us well, and I honestly don’t know the answer, or rather, don’t know what system is best to replace it.

I wouldn’t be looking to Tasmania or New Zealand for answers.


I'm a strong believer in the way we go about things in elections in Australia, particularly the preferential voting system. I think it's the best system, although there are benefits to the Tasmanian system (not a fan of the NZ system personally).
R.I.P. the SANFL 1877 - 2013
User avatar
RB
Coach
 
Posts: 5652
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:45 pm
Has liked: 767 times
Been liked: 1075 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby dedja » Fri Dec 08, 2023 12:47 pm

Thanks RB, that link was useful.
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt
User avatar
dedja
Coach
 
 
Posts: 20253
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:10 pm
Has liked: 178 times
Been liked: 996 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby dedja » Wed Feb 28, 2024 6:53 pm

Labor and Libs seemingly in a race to the bottom in their attempts to discredit the other candidate in the lead up to the Dunstan by-election.
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt
User avatar
dedja
Coach
 
 
Posts: 20253
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:10 pm
Has liked: 178 times
Been liked: 996 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:04 pm

dedja wrote:Labor and Libs seemingly in a race to the bottom in their attempts to discredit the other candidate in the lead up to the Dunstan by-election.


Kuntsantonis doing his typical shite
His mother wouldn't let him touch the till in his first job
His second job as a cabbie went even better
User avatar
Jimmy_041
Coach
 
 
Posts: 14001
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:30 pm
Has liked: 720 times
Been liked: 1072 times
Grassroots Team: Prince Alfred OC

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby DOC » Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:08 pm

One of the most astute members of parliament this state has ever seen.

When it comes to psychological warfare he is nearly always dealing with unarmed opponents.

Numerous libs have tried to take him on and they always lose.He will remain in Government as a minister for as long as David Spiers is the libs leader. Political lightweight but an impressive property portfolio owner.
Last edited by DOC on Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
DOC
Coach
 
 
Posts: 17981
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 7:15 pm
Has liked: 732 times
Been liked: 2087 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:12 pm

DOC wrote:One of the most astute members of parliament this state has ever seen.

Numerous libs have tried to take him on and they always lose.


"astute" is a good observation
No-one on the other side can get that low down in the swamp.
He's got good history with swamps.
User avatar
Jimmy_041
Coach
 
 
Posts: 14001
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:30 pm
Has liked: 720 times
Been liked: 1072 times
Grassroots Team: Prince Alfred OC

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby DOC » Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:15 pm

Indeed.
User avatar
DOC
Coach
 
 
Posts: 17981
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 7:15 pm
Has liked: 732 times
Been liked: 2087 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Jimmy_041 » Thu Feb 29, 2024 1:42 pm

DOC wrote:Indeed.


Classic of what doesn't kill you makes you stronger

Michael Abbott KC did SA no favours
User avatar
Jimmy_041
Coach
 
 
Posts: 14001
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:30 pm
Has liked: 720 times
Been liked: 1072 times
Grassroots Team: Prince Alfred OC

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Booney » Mon Mar 18, 2024 9:29 am

Libs going to hold Dunstan?
PAFC. Forever.

LOOK OUT, WE'RE COMING!
User avatar
Booney
Coach
 
 
Posts: 58372
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 1:47 pm
Location: Alberton proud
Has liked: 7494 times
Been liked: 10781 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Brodlach » Sat Mar 23, 2024 7:56 pm

Looking like ALP will win Dunstan
July 11th 2012....
Brodlach wrote:Rory Laird might end up the best IMO, he is an absolute jet. He has been in great form at the Bloods
User avatar
Brodlach
Coach
 
 
Posts: 47323
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:18 pm
Location: Unley
Has liked: 72 times
Been liked: 4216 times
Grassroots Team: Colonel Light Gardens

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby am Bays » Sat Mar 23, 2024 8:12 pm

https://result.ecsa.sa.gov.au/
12% counted
Libs 40 % -6.7%
ALP 30.9 % - 4.2%
Greens 23.4% + 9.7%

ALP win if those figures hold
Let that be a lesson to you Port, no one beats the Bays five times in a row in a GF and gets away with it!!!
User avatar
am Bays
Coach
 
 
Posts: 18568
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:04 pm
Location: The back bar at Lennies
Has liked: 164 times
Been liked: 1812 times

Re: The South Australian Political Landscape

Postby Brodlach » Sat Mar 23, 2024 8:17 pm

Two party
ALP 58.9
Libs 41.1
July 11th 2012....
Brodlach wrote:Rory Laird might end up the best IMO, he is an absolute jet. He has been in great form at the Bloods
User avatar
Brodlach
Coach
 
 
Posts: 47323
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:18 pm
Location: Unley
Has liked: 72 times
Been liked: 4216 times
Grassroots Team: Colonel Light Gardens

PreviousNext

Board index   General Talk  Politics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 20 guests

Around the place

Competitions   SANFL Official Site | Country Footy SA | Southern Football League | VFL Footy
Club Forums   Snouts Louts | The Roost | Redlegs Forum |