2013 Federal election - Rudd sets date as 7th September

[bulldogproud2]

Again, if you want to believe that , then it is your choice.

Cheers

Thanks, and it is your choice to be wrong

Only kidding, you are entitled to your opinion - that is what makes the world go around!

[Psyber]

Well they are two very different things.
Maybe the QLD govt just don't want Garratt promoting the benefits of Gonski

From my perspective the ALP are promoting the Myth of Gonski, in the hope it will get the public on side and force the states hands, and pick up a few votes.
It isn't, so far, attractive enough to the states to get off the ground even if the ALP won in September.

It is rather like many of the proposed Medicare Locals having fallen through because they couldn't persuade enough medical practices to move out of their existing and established rooms into more expensive ones at the proposed complexes.

[bulldogproud2]

Well they are two very different things.
Maybe the QLD govt just don't want Garratt promoting the benefits of Gonski

From my perspective the ALP are promoting the Myth of Gonski, in the hope it will get the public on side and force the states hands, and pick up a few votes.
It isn't, so far, attractive enough to the states to get off the ground even if the ALP won in September.

It is rather like many of the proposed Medicare Locals having fallen through because they couldn't persuade enough medical practices to move out of their existing and established rooms into more expensive ones at the proposed complexes.

It is rather sad though that the states are so slow to sign up to it. From an educationalist's point of view, it is the reform that Australia has been needing for decades.
I have a feeling all states will sign up by June 30. They just know they have a chance of getting a sweeter deal by waiting

[Jimmy_041]

1. It's not his workplace
2. He wants to score some political points

BIG fail on both points

It is his workplace. He is the head of education in Australia.
He is the boss, no matter what the state's political leaders say.

Your Honour;

I submit this as proof of Point 2: http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/national/man-the-gates-pm-orders-school-campaign/story-fncz7kyc-1226662796496

[bulldogproud2]

1. It's not his workplace
2. He wants to score some political points

BIG fail on both points

It is his workplace. He is the head of education in Australia.
He is the boss, no matter what the state's political leaders say.

Your Honour;

I submit this as proof of Point 2: http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/national/man-the-gates-pm-orders-school-campaign/story-fncz7kyc-1226662796496

As stated in the article, this is in response to the coalition's crazy idea to lock people out of their workplace, a measure the coalition is doing for purely political purposes.

If the coalition are worried that Mr. Garrett will say things that are incorrect about the Gonski reforms, they are quite welcome to send a member to join him on his visit to the schools. However, unfortunately they know that the Gonski reforms are hugely beneficial to schools, so REFUSE to do so. Instead, they lock the Federal Minister of Education out of his workplace. How silly is that????

I much prefer the Victorian response where they will quite happily allow Mr. Garrett into schools, as long as he makes them aware of his presence.
Cheers

[Jimmy_041]

1. It's not his workplace
2. He wants to score some political points

BIG fail on both points

It is his workplace. He is the head of education in Australia.
He is the boss, no matter what the state's political leaders say.

Your Honour;

I submit this as proof of Point 2: http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/national/man-the-gates-pm-orders-school-campaign/story-fncz7kyc-1226662796496

As stated in the article, this is in response to the coalition's crazy idea to lock people out of their workplace, a measure the coalition is doing for purely political purposes.

If the coalition are worried that Mr. Garrett will say things that are incorrect about the Gonski reforms, they are quite welcome to send a member to join him on his visit to the schools. However, unfortunately they know that the Gonski reforms are hugely beneficial to schools, so REFUSE to do so. Instead, they lock the Federal Minister of Education out of his workplace. How silly is that????

I much prefer the Victorian response where they will quite happily allow Mr. Garrett into schools, as long as he makes them aware of his presence.
Cheers

Well, we will disagree about all this. How about we have one last go each and move on - at least we're discussing the point and not getting personal which used to happen on here by other people.

The schools are on State, not Federal, land and are run by State, not Federal, administration. It is therefore not his workplace, and the biggest proof of this point is.....they have locked him out. He has no legal right to enter the school.

The lockout is political but responding to a political stunt which the government now intends to turn into an even bigger political stunt. To be perfectly frank, I'd let him in. It will achieve nothing and locking him out has actually given him more oxygen than letting him in.

Cheers (good touch that)

[Bully]

why would you let im in, seen as he wont be the minister on the 15th of September

cheers

[Jimmy_041]

Scare the kids day

[bulldogproud2]

Well, we will disagree about all this. How about we have one last go each and move on - at least we're discussing the point and not getting personal which used to happen on here by other people.

The schools are on State, not Federal, land and are run by State, not Federal, administration. It is therefore not his workplace, and the biggest proof of this point is.....they have locked him out. He has no legal right to enter the school.

The lockout is political but responding to a political stunt which the government now intends to turn into an even bigger political stunt. To be perfectly frank, I'd let him in. It will achieve nothing and locking him out has actually given him more oxygen than letting him in.

Cheers (good touch that)

True, I am glad that we have not reverted to name calling. I must admit that I did that recently and felt really bad afterwards. Thankfully, the person I did that too and I have made up and become good mates.

Although, yes, state schools are on state land, this still does not stop the school from being his workplace. As Federal Education Minister, Peter Garrett has overriding responsibility for all schools in Australia. If this was not the case, then no state school would receive any funding from the Federal Government. The fact that they do pretty much proves that the Federal Government has a role to play in the administration of state schools.

Added to that is the fact that state schools are subject to a NATIONAL curriculum, developed by the Federal Education Department. If state schools were totally independent of the Federal Government, this could never happen.

Therefore, any state school in Australia is clearly a workplace for the Federal Minister of Education.

If he decided to take the State Government of Queensland to court, Peter Garrett should be able to get the ban overturned. However, it is not worth the worry and would not really achieve anything.

Anyway, good conversing with you. Every person is entitled to their opinions and yours are very well thought out.

Cheers (and I really mean that)

[bulldogproud2]

why would you let im in, seen as he wont be the minister on the 15th of September

cheers

... and one day the term of the next Federal Minister of Education will end too, so, therefore you would never let them in either??

[Psyber]

It is rather sad though that the states are so slow to sign up to it. From an educationalist's point of view, it is the reform that Australia has been needing for decades.
I have a feeling all states will sign up by June 30. They just know they have a chance of getting a sweeter deal by waiting

I'm inclined to think only the states that don't believe they have to keep their budget deficits within reasonable bounds will sign up unless the federal government ups the offers and blows its budget even more.
Then you may be right they may all do just that.

From a former school student point of view, from the days of classes of 50 plus, I'm inclined to think the issue isn't so much money and staffing as the philosophy and curriculum of education today.
Teachers I've seen as WorkCover victims/claimants, after they've fought a losing battle to maintain educational standards, have tended to express similar views.

[Bully]

why would you let im in, seen as he wont be the minister on the 15th of September

cheers

... and one day the term of the next Federal Minister of Education will end too, so, therefore you would never let them in either??

but there wont be an issue(major) like there is with the current minister with the new one but who knows....

but I agree, the discussions here are not personal or personal attacks which is the best thing

[mick]

It is rather sad though that the states are so slow to sign up to it. From an educationalist's point of view, it is the reform that Australia has been needing for decades.
I have a feeling all states will sign up by June 30. They just know they have a chance of getting a sweeter deal by waiting

I'm inclined to think only the states that don't believe they have to keep their budget deficits within reasonable bounds will sign up unless the federal government ups the offers and blows its budget even more.
Then you may be right they may all do just that.

From a former school student point of view, from the days of classes of 50 plus, I'm inclined to think the issue isn't so much money and staffing as the philosophy and curriculum of education today.
Teachers I've seen as WorkCover victims/claimants, after they've fought a losing battle to maintain educational standards, have tended to express similar views.

My feelings exactly and I think why there has been a big move to private education by many people. It is simplistic to simply believe that throwing vast sums of money at education will improve it. Some teachers seem terrified at the prospect of some sort of review of their performance that can be quantitated. Teaching should be a more highly paid job and held in high esteem by the community to attract the brightest and best, and those who don't cut the mustard be encouraged into other occupations.

[Bully]

heard that SA has signed onto gonski today

[Bully]

no sandwich throwing at K Rudd in Sydney today ?

[Jimmy_041]

OK, so we have now been told how much money SA will get from the Gonski pork barrel
Does anyone know how it compares to current funding?
Sincere question - I really don't know
How good is it really?

[Bully]

im told and have heard that its not as much as the current states that have signed up to it. Maybe something to do with population I don't know, but Christopher phyne was on sky before and he says SA has missed out more than the other states

[Jimmy_041]

So, has anyone got a comparison in $ terms or is it not done like that?

[shoe boy]

im told and have heard that its not as much as the current states that have signed up to it. Maybe something to do with population I don't know, but Christopher phyne was on sky before and he says SA has missed out more than the other states

Can anyone take this bloke seriously!

[Sojourner]

It is rather sad though that the states are so slow to sign up to it. From an educationalist's point of view, it is the reform that Australia has been needing for decades.
I have a feeling all states will sign up by June 30. They just know they have a chance of getting a sweeter deal by waiting

WA's deal went from 300mil to 900mil this last week and I have no doubt that the longer they hold on, 1.2bil is not out the question, so why wouldent they, especailly when they know that is what they have to to do get the the extra funding?