$peed camera$ - only in accident hot$pot$

[fish]

SPEED DOES NOT KILL

That is rubbish Sabre extra speed means less chance of avoiding a collision and extra chance of death to you or somone else due to the higher energy involved in the collision.

[SABRE]

SPEED DOES NOT KILL

That is rubbish Sabre extra speed means less chance of avoiding a collision and extra chance of death to you or somone else due to the higher energy involved in the collision.

Exactly 'fish',
Excessive speeds = Stupidity
As I said, speed alone does not kill. As proven on race tracks around the world every day.
It is driver error or mechanical failure that causes accidents. People are killed in accidents
under the limit too. Speed just makes the damage worse. I said that. We are in agreement.
Those with a total disregard for the safety of others deserve all that they get.

Apart from people who can't afford a fine spending too much time glued to the speedo,
what I'm alluding to, is that there are many situations where a driver can inadvertantly find
themselves fined through no fault of their own, and those fines can have serious consequences.
It's happened to me, it's happened to friends of mine, it can happen to the most careful of
drivers, in a great number of ways, e.g. where for one reason or another, speed signs are
missing, obstructed, defaced, misplaced or otherwise unseen. There are more sinister causes too.

For privacy reasons I won't go into detail, but some time ago a friend of mine was pulled over
at a radar trap and arbitrarily fined. The young officers involved had pulled over the wrong car,
which was similar, but refused to admit they'd made an error. The matter went to court but the
police involved refused to tell the truth. My friend was deeply hurt by this injustice and when
marital, financial and other personal problems proved too much, he took his own life.
I hope this explains where I'm coming from on this issue. With 2 teenagers now on the road,
I care very much about road safety, but there are many sides to the story.
Cheers,
SABRE.

[Psyber]

SPEED DOES NOT KILL

That is rubbish Sabre extra speed means less chance of avoiding a collision and extra chance of death to you or someone else due to the higher energy involved in the collision.

True, and of course, pushing this to the logical conclusion, all cars should be stationary, or there should be jobs for people walking in front of cars with the red flags...
More seriously though, I don't condone speeding in built up areas, but I do believe our speed limits on major country roads far from dense habitation are unduly restrictive.

PS: I've had about 6 collisions in my motoring career over 48 years, and only in two of them was I doing more than 10Km per hour, despite my fondness for speed on the open road.
[Either I backed into someone, or they did to me, turning in tight situations.]

[aceman]

Would you rather they raised taxes?

I have no problem with speed cameras being used as revenue raisers ... Remember you need to be approx 10% over the speed limit to be caught. If you can't stay under 67km/h in a 60 zone then you deserve to be caught, bottom of a hill or not.

So it's your choice whether you contribute to the state coffers or not.

i was of the understanding they dropped the 10% rule and lowered it to around 5%

Correct weight, the 10% went 2 years ago.

[dedja]

Would you rather they raised taxes?

I have no problem with speed cameras being used as revenue raisers ... Remember you need to be approx 10% over the speed limit to be caught. If you can't stay under 67km/h in a 60 zone then you deserve to be caught, bottom of a hill or not.

So it's your choice whether you contribute to the state coffers or not.

i was of the understanding they dropped the 10% rule and lowered it to around 5%

Correct weight, the 10% went 2 years ago.

Meh, doesn't invalidate the argument in any way ... 64km/h in a 60k zone then.

I'm no Einstein but have only had 2 speeding fines on nearly 30 years and none on the last 2 years. Jeez, it ain't rocket science.

[aceman]

Would you rather they raised taxes?

I have no problem with speed cameras being used as revenue raisers ... Remember you need to be approx 10% over the speed limit to be caught. If you can't stay under 67km/h in a 60 zone then you deserve to be caught, bottom of a hill or not.

So it's your choice whether you contribute to the state coffers or not.

i was of the understanding they dropped the 10% rule and lowered it to around 5%

Correct weight, the 10% went 2 years ago.

Meh, doesn't invalidate the argument in any way ... 64km/h in a 60k zone then.

I'm no Einstein but have only had 2 speeding fines on nearly 30 years and none on the last 2 years. Jeez, it ain't rocket science.

Good for you, I 've had 1 in 30 years. My original post was about the fact that the idea of speed cameras according to the "spin" was to have them in known accident 'hotspots' and the one they had in the bus stop on Nelson road. Has not been an accident in that vicinity for 20 years so how is it a "hotspot?". More likely as it's at the bottom of a two way decline in the road = $$$

[dedja]

LOL, welcome to the real world ...

[Psyber]

Meh, doesn't invalidate the argument in any way ... 64km/h in a 60k zone then.
I'm no Einstein but have only had 2 speeding fines on nearly 30 years and none on the last 2 years. Jeez, it ain't rocket science.

I reckon I average about 1 a year - for exceeding the limit on country roads. I'm prepared to pay the tax for the convenience and freedom from frustration...
I'm 5 points down at present, which is more than usual, but 3 expire on February 2011.

[dedja]

Meh, doesn't invalidate the argument in any way ... 64km/h in a 60k zone then.
I'm no Einstein but have only had 2 speeding fines on nearly 30 years and none on the last 2 years. Jeez, it ain't rocket science.

I reckon I average about 1 a year - for exceeding the limit on country roads. I'm prepared to pay the tax for the convenience and freedom from frustration...
I'm 5 points down at present, which is more than usual, but 3 expire on February 2011.

LOL, nice way of putting it.

[fish]

As far as I know exceeding the speed limit is illegal on all roads in all parts of the state. As such you can expect to be expiated for speeding anywhere in the State, not just in "accident" hot spots (they are not accidents if speed is a factor). To many people, the chance of getting caught and fined anywhere in the state acts as a great deterrent to speeding and contributes to a safer road environment for everyone.

The fact that speeding fines also raise money for the state is great - it helps pay for the huge medical costs that are borne by the government as a result of road collisions.

I reckon the speeding fines should be greater, particularly for repeat offenders. Impounding of vehicles and/or suspension of licenses should also be consequences for repeat offenders.

[Psyber]

Fish is right up to a point.
I don't exceed the speed limit where it is a sensible limit, like in towns and cities or near schools, and I support the lowering it to 50K in residential areas.
In fact, there are places where 100k is legal and I wouldn't drive that fast on those roads, because it looks unsafe to me, even in a sound vehicle.
However, there are places where the arbitrary 100 or 110K limits are ludicrous, and exceeding them is not unsafe.
There, I regard them as "more honoured in the breach than the observance", to borrow from Shakespeare.

Sure not all cars are sound, and not all drivers are competent, but perhaps instead of setting limits to allow for that they should be off the road as dangerous at any speed.

[FattyLumpkin]

In good old Qld they're talking of lowering the threshold to 1km/h!

Need a good hard look at the evidence behind where/how road fatalities occur, the act on the evidence. Raising revenue at a "safe" road does nothing to the road toll.
Another thing - appropriate speed limits. Newell Hwy just reduced from 110k to 100. It's a beautiful stretch of road, staright, wide & safe - should be closer to 120k. However its speed limit is the same as the narrow, winding New England Hwy, where 90k/h in places should be the limit.

[Psyber]

I've several times run through the formulae behind the "Knock off 5" campaign about how much faster you are allegedly going at the point of impact if you start off 5 kph faster.
It just doesn't work out the way claimed in the campaign, and looks like a deliberate lie to me.
It reduces the credibility of other speed and road safety policy, as do the situations Fatty referred to..

And of course how can you avoid being fined if the speed tolerance on the road is less than the +/- 10% speedometers are allowed to have in their manufacture.
That reinforces the view that it is just a new tax increase by stealth, by greedy state governments who promised no new taxes..

[FattyLumpkin]

Given the low Qld threshold, I've tried driving at 58-60 since Jan 1. Bloody tough given Brisbane's hills & you're spending more time looking at the speedo than the road. I reckon I'm an unsafer driver now than before.

[Interceptor]

Given the low Qld threshold, I've tried driving at 58-60 since Jan 1. Bloody tough given Brisbane's hills & you're spending more time looking at the speedo than the road. I reckon I'm an unsafer driver now than before.

I think you've jumped the gun slightly on the tolerance change.
This article suggests it hasn't been altered yet, but probably will:

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/drivers-set-to-lose-speeding-leeway-20100104-lnus.html

[SABRE]

Given the low Qld threshold, I've tried driving at 58-60 since Jan 1. Bloody tough given Brisbane's hills & you're spending more time looking at the speedo than the road. I reckon I'm an unsafer driver now than before.

Spot on 'Fatty' !
It only takes a split second for a child to run or ride out onto the road and if your eyes are
constantly looking down nervously at the speedo to avoid outrageous revenue raising fines .....

Speed cameras DO NOT save lives. How can they? Most people travelling over the limit go
through them without knowing and continue on their merry way, totally oblivious of the minor
offence committed.
If the authorities were fair dinkum about reducing the road toll they would stop this crock of
excrement and put resources into getting idiots like the one who passed me on Findon road
a month ago doing at least 110 in a 60 zone, or the pinheaded P plater doing 150-160
between O'Halloran Hill & Reynella last week. Straight through a red light as well !
And where was Officer Olley? He was pulling over Aunty Agnes with his speed gun because she
had been travelling at 55 km/h in her already safe, wide, but now suddenly a 40 km/h street.
You know, the ones complete with speed humps that aggravate her sciatica, put the lives of
ambulance patients in danger and wreck your suspension, chassis & wheel alignment.
How dare she commit the hanging offence of going 5 km/h UNDER a limit she safely travelled
for 55 bloody years !

What a joke !

[FattyLumpkin]

Given the low Qld threshold, I've tried driving at 58-60 since Jan 1. Bloody tough given Brisbane's hills & you're spending more time looking at the speedo than the road. I reckon I'm an unsafer driver now than before.

I think you've jumped the gun slightly on the tolerance change.
This article suggests it hasn't been altered yet, but probably will:

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/drivers-set-to-lose-speeding-leeway-20100104-lnus.html

Trying to "re-educate" my driving habits before it comes in place - 'cos it's bloody difficult to maintain a speed that does not creep 1k over 60 - unless of course I drive everywhere at 50.

[Psyber]

It is almost impossible to maintain oneself within 5kph of any speed with any reliability without keeping your eyes on the speedo rather than the road, especially if your car is reasonably powerful.
At the moment because I've racked up a few points lately I'm setting the cruise control anywhere traffic conditions don't force frequent deceleration and acceleration.
I'm also retraining myself to set the gadget I fitted that beeps at me when I drift up, but remembering to do that diverts my attention off the traffic momentarily too a bit too often when the zones keep changing.

In particular I'm having trouble with the 50 zones in SA, having to watch for signs.
In Victoria roads with while centre lines were 60k and those without were 50, but it's not that consistent here.
I like the NSW tendency to print the speed zone on the road surface every so often so you don't have to look behind trees and poles for a semi-hidden sign changing the speed limit.

[fish]

Given the low Qld threshold, I've tried driving at 58-60 since Jan 1. Bloody tough given Brisbane's hills & you're spending more time looking at the speedo than the road. I reckon I'm an unsafer driver now than before.

Spot on 'Fatty' !
It only takes a split second for a child to run or ride out onto the road and if your eyes are
constantly looking down nervously at the speedo to avoid outrageous revenue raising fines .....

If you can't drive steadily at 55-60kph in a 60 zone without looking at your speedo all the time maybe you should not be driving...

[dedja]

what he said ...