The never ending No AFL in the SANFL whinge thread

[tipper]

the only bullshit i have seen on this topic has been fro the "pro" reserves posters. so far everything the "anti" posters have said has proven to be accurate.

4000 crows fans to games - wrong. the crows are lucky to get that across two games, including opposition supporters

increased exposure - wrong. sanfl now pays a million dollars a year to televise the reserves sides... not sure how that helps the rest of the clubs

help the clubs survive - wrong. with only two clubs posting a profit last year. the 50k the crows pay is quickly dwarfed by the lack of people at the ground

adding the crows will get rid of the bye - wrong. we now have the farcical situation where in an "even" comp we have more bye's than ever

removes the "interference" of afl players in all sides - wrong. its now just condensed into two sides, having a much greater effect on results. ffs the crows had that many out at the start of last season they lost to North (how bad can you be?). not sure how that can be considered to be better than it being spread more evenly around the comp (not that i want a return to the old system either)

im sure there are many other points that can be added here. we even have "pro" posters that have begun seeing the light. BennyMacca above now admits that it has been a negative addition to the competition. too bad there were not more realising that back when it could still be prevented, we wouldnt now be stuck with this shit sandwich

[Booney]

Could it really have been prevented?

[whufc]

Could it really have been prevented?

Not sure but some presidents definitely could have put their clubs before their personal ambitions

[RB]

Could it really have been prevented?

If you're referring to the entrance of the two AFL teams, then yes, easily.

Unfortunately only two league clubs had integrity. Had there been three, this monstrosity wouldn't have happened.

Of course, if the six pieces of scum had set out their agenda before the AGMs at the beginning of 2013/end of 2012, they would not have been voted in.

[JohnnyG]

How come Keiran Agius from North Adelaide has been allowed to sign up as a top up player for the Port Power AFL reserves team?
What are the current rules?

It is now 2016, can I ask again:
(i) Will the Power reserves be entitled to the SANFL annual dividend again in 2016?
If yes (notionally or otherwise) then why?
If no then what financial contribution are they making to the SANFL in 2016 for the right to participate in the SANFL?
Why are Port still making NIL payments to the SANFL whereas Crows pay $400,000pa?

Why are Port Power still allowed to have an Academy team in the SANFL ?(which also messes up our SANFL seconds competition)

[UK Fan]

Could it really have been prevented?

Yep easily

[tipper]

Could it really have been prevented?

if the club presidents (or at least enough of them) had voted no, how could it have been forced? if they stood their ground, instead of bending over and backing up, what could the crows and power really have done about it?

its all a moot point anyway. its happened, now we need to move on to rectifying the situation by removing the reserves sides. and while bugsy and the north board will disagree with me, can anyone honestly say that the reserves sides have been a positive for the sanfl? i certainly cant see any positives

(there are some for the afl clubs, sure, but i am referring to positives for the sanfl)

[Booney]

Could it really have been prevented?

if the club presidents (or at least enough of them) had voted no, how could it have been forced? if they stood their ground, instead of bending over and backing up, what could the crows and power really have done about it?

its all a moot point anyway. its happened, now we need to move on to rectifying the situation by removing the reserves sides. and while bugsy and the north board will disagree with me, can anyone honestly say that the reserves sides have been a positive for the sanfl? i certainly cant see any positives

(there are some for the afl clubs, sure, but i am referring to positives for the sanfl)

I don't think it would have been "forced" publicly, if you don't think the 6 "yes" votes needed to be persuaded then I'd be surprised.

So while the financial reward seduced a couple of strugglers into agreeing without reading the fine print I'd think at least a few of the "yes" votes had some reasonable pressure applied. Forced, no, pressured, without doubt.

So could it have been prevented, I doubt it.

I too can't see anything positive to come of it for the SANFL, if there is I'm not looking closely enough.

[tipper]

they still could have stood strong. out the "persuasion" publicly and embarrass the afl clubs that were trying to strong arm them. i agree that there were back room discussions going on. the Norwood presidents abrupt about face highlights that, but if they had integrity, and put the sanfl first, they would have stood their ground. surely there is only so much "pressure" that could be applied.

its like 'negotiating" with a toddler. they kick, they scream, but giving in and giving them what they want only validates their tactics, and they know you will break again next time. stand your ground, ignore the tantrum, and eventually they fall asleep on the lounge room floor leaving you in peace

[Booney]

they still could have stood strong. out the "persuasion" publicly and embarrass the afl clubs that were trying to strong arm them. i agree that there were back room discussions going on. the Norwood presidents abrupt about face highlights that, but if they had integrity, and put the sanfl first, they would have stood their ground. surely there is only so much "pressure" that could be applied.

its like 'negotiating" with a toddler. they kick, they scream, but giving in and giving them what they want only validates their tactics, and they know you will break again next time. stand your ground, ignore the tantrum, and eventually they fall asleep on the lounge room floor leaving you in peace

I'd say it was more the SANFL bigwigs and not so much the AFL clubs applying the blow torch.

Anyway, I better move on before someone notices I support one of the AFL clubs and my view is irrelevant.

[tipper]

they still could have stood strong. out the "persuasion" publicly and embarrass the afl clubs that were trying to strong arm them. i agree that there were back room discussions going on. the Norwood presidents abrupt about face highlights that, but if they had integrity, and put the sanfl first, they would have stood their ground. surely there is only so much "pressure" that could be applied.

its like 'negotiating" with a toddler. they kick, they scream, but giving in and giving them what they want only validates their tactics, and they know you will break again next time. stand your ground, ignore the tantrum, and eventually they fall asleep on the lounge room floor leaving you in peace

I'd say it was more the SANFL bigwigs and not so much the AFL clubs applying the blow torch.

Anyway, I better move on before someone notices I support one of the AFL clubs and my view is irrelevant.

shit, thats right. **** off back to the afl boards you troll

[bennymacca]

its like 'negotiating" with a toddler. they kick, they scream, but giving in and giving them what they want only validates their tactics, and they know you will break again next time. stand your ground, ignore the tantrum, and eventually they fall asleep on the lounge room floor leaving you in peace

it does seem like there are plenty of SANFL fans who have kicked the toys out of the cot too.

[tipper]

its like 'negotiating" with a toddler. they kick, they scream, but giving in and giving them what they want only validates their tactics, and they know you will break again next time. stand your ground, ignore the tantrum, and eventually they fall asleep on the lounge room floor leaving you in peace

it does seem like there are plenty of SANFL fans who have kicked the toys out of the cot too.

not really, the sanfl fans are right. everything they have predicted about this situation has come true. they have the facts on their side, and its the "pro" reserves people that are stubbornly cutting off their nose to spite their face. "its not that bad" "crowds arent down" "wait, crowds are down but only because of (insert bullshit here)" "its too late now you just have to get used to it".......

you will understand in a few years when your little one moves from baby to infant to toddler. they are very stubborn when presented with irrefutable facts and maintain their position anyway. certainly seems more like the pro reserves people to me

[bennymacca]

I agree that it seems to be a fair bit worse than predicted, but i feel like it is somewhat a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Bloke predicts that nobody will go
Bloke doesnt go
Bloke says "i told you so"

That is a failing of the AFL sides. I have heard a lot from the crows about how being in the SANFL will be good, but I dont see that much of an effort to actually get me to a game. I think they were just operating on the assumption that lots of us crows fans would go, especially when the AFL side is playing in melbourne.

However well intentioned those crowd figures are, they are clearly wrong, and the AFL sides need to help in rectifying that. That may help rectify the slide of some died-in-the-wool supporters who will never come back. And if the SANFL starts turning things around, they may even come back too

[cracka]

Is there a majority of support from SANFL people to get rid of the AFL reserves (certainly on here it is) & if so surely something can be done.

[whufc]

I agree that it seems to be a fair bit worse than predicted, but i feel like it is somewhat a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Bloke predicts that nobody will go
Bloke doesnt go
Bloke says "i told you so"

That is a failing of the AFL sides. I have heard a lot from the crows about how being in the SANFL will be good, but I dont see that much of an effort to actually get me to a game. I think they were just operating on the assumption that lots of us crows fans would go, especially when the AFL side is playing in melbourne.

However well intentioned those crowd figures are, they are clearly wrong, and the AFL sides need to help in rectifying that. That may help rectify the slide of some died-in-the-wool supporters who will never come back. And if the SANFL starts turning things around, they may even come back too

While there would be some truth in that from my personal experience with all my friendship groups etc etc there has been a massive drop off in the 'casual' fan.

I have alot of mates who support both Centrals and Crows and these days its almost impossible to get them to come a game. Most of them were passionate about both their sides but that seems to have diminished and their interest in the SANFL as whole has waned and they simply follow the AFL

[bennymacca]

I have alot of mates who support both Centrals and Crows and these days its almost impossible to get them to come a game. Most of them were passionate about both their sides but that seems to have diminished and their interest in the SANFL as whole has waned and they simply follow the AFL

Yep, I would count myself in that category. When I was a teenager I used to go to probably 5-6 Centrals games, and 2 crows games a year. Those centrals games dropped off as I went to uni and started working, just purely due to time pressures. Its quite hard to follow two teams and given them all of your time.

So now I have a choice and that choice is the Crows. But yeah, If the crows werent in the SANFL, I would still likely go to a couple of centrals games, now I dont go to any (well I went to 1 i think)

[whufc]

I have alot of mates who support both Centrals and Crows and these days its almost impossible to get them to come a game. Most of them were passionate about both their sides but that seems to have diminished and their interest in the SANFL as whole has waned and they simply follow the AFL

Yep, I would count myself in that category. When I was a teenager I used to go to probably 5-6 Centrals games, and 2 crows games a year. Those centrals games dropped off as I went to uni and started working, just purely due to time pressures. Its quite hard to follow two teams and given them all of your time.

So now I have a choice and that choice is the Crows. But yeah, If the crows werent in the SANFL, I would still likely go to a couple of centrals games, now I dont go to any (well I went to 1 i think)

I think it hasnt helped these type of supporters can now sit at home, watch both the televised SANFL and AFL game, either listen to pretty much anyone of the other games in the SANFL and AFL on radio or live on the net, throw in the ability to buy your own alcohol, have sky racing on and not having to pay an entry fee and it seems like a much better day.

[bennymacca]

I got foxtel last year too, and I dont think that helps.

If there was a saturday arvo where there was no AFL on TV, I may have gone down to Elizabeth.

Now I can watch that same SANFL game on TV, combined with 2 or 3 crappy fox AFL games, which all adds up to me sitting on the couch instead.

Having said all that, I dont think not televising the games is an answer.

[spell_check]

increased exposure - wrong. sanfl now pays a million dollars a year to televise the reserves sides... not sure how that helps the rest of the clubs

And 18 minor round matches only on TV instead of 23; which in an ideal average would be 3-4 matches per side right now, as opposed to 5 and change before