Bali Nine - is the death penalty justice?

[Dogwatcher]

Interestingly, I've spoken to someone in the past hour who is now coming back from Bali who claims to have video evidence of Indonesian officials recently trying to bribe one of the two men, suggesting they can still avoid the death sentence.
This person met with one of the men as late as Tuesday and claims that even at that point, he was still more concerned with asking about their family than his own fate - according to them, he never even mentioned it.
They also claim that the President's own brother, who she has had contact with, has tried to talk him out of the execution.

[Coach Bombay]

I'm in Bali at the moment, it's getting no coverage over here at all.

[Dogwatcher]

Those ignorant Indonesians, why don't they care about us?

[stan]

Those ignorant Indonesians, why don't they care about us?

They do carr about us. They care very deepy about us going there and spending money. [emoji6]

[RustyCage]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -shut.html


But... But.... But..... He's such a nice young man who just made a mistake because he was young....

[fisho mcspaz]

An old classmate of mine has just organised this and I think it's a great idea. I'll cut/paste the details from FB. No venue has been decided upon yet but I'll keep you posted.


CANDLELIGHT VIGIL FOR ANDREW AND MYURAN - WEDNESDAY MARCH 11

Time: 8pm-9pm
Venue: TBA

“It could be 10 days.”

These were the words of the Indonesian Attorney-General HM Prasetyo on Thursday regarding the impending execution of Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran, as reported by the SMH today.

Please join us in taking this opportunity to stand together for mercy on Wednesday the 13th of March from 8pm in the Adelaide CBD.

This will be a multi denominational gathering.

We have the week ahead to spread the word and make a powerful statement. Please help by inviting your friends and family, school and uni groups, office colleagues and prayer groups. Paint banners, make stickers and posters, get creative!

Let’s come together and show our support for Andrew and Myuran.

PS: As part of the Adelaide Festival there is a FREE light show, Blinc, in Elder Park after dusk. It will be a great place to explore, so lets make it a night of light!

[Q.]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2869230/Bali-Nine-ringleader-Andrew-Chan-mastermind-international-drug-deal-went-horribly-wrong-threatened-17-year-old-mule-Hong-Kong-jail-mouth-shut.html


But... But.... But..... He's such a nice young man who just made a mistake because he was young....

Definitely deserves to be murdered then.

[fisho mcspaz]

Just an update on tonight's vigil:

Time: 8pm-9pm
Venue: Lifepoint Church, 11 Park Tce Gilberton

There will be several speakers throughout the programme. I'll be MCing the event. Please feel free to come along and show your support.

[MW]

I hear Bishop has now offered to cover the costs of jailing them for life...ffs give me a break.

[Booney]

I hear Bishop has now offered to cover the costs of jailing them for life...ffs give me a break.

interesting. With her own money, or that of the taxpayer?

[Q.]

I hear Bishop has now offered to cover the costs of jailing them for life...ffs give me a break.

interesting. With her own money, or that of the taxpayer?

With the money they're gonna cut from schooling and health in remote aboriginal communities.

[fisho mcspaz]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2869230/Bali-Nine-ringleader-Andrew-Chan-mastermind-international-drug-deal-went-horribly-wrong-threatened-17-year-old-mule-Hong-Kong-jail-mouth-shut.html


But... But.... But..... He's such a nice young man who just made a mistake because he was young....

Definitely deserves to be murdered then.

In the last few days I've become a lot more involved with Andrew and Myuran's plight, and it's changed a big part of the way I was thinking. I've never been for capital punishment, so to me, their conduct in jail doesn't make a particle of difference as to whether or not they deserve to die. But I've been arguing the fact of their rehabilitation nonetheless, because it matters to other people. It certainly matters in the arguments Australia have been presenting to Indonesia. And if I really want to be honest with myself, I guess to me, personally, it made the prospect of their pending executions that much worse. If they had behaved badly in prison instead, I don't think I would have felt the same magnitude of horror... then. That is, the idea of their deaths would've appalled me no matter what. But it seemed doubly worse when I thought about how much they've done to improve conditions inside Kerobokan, the classes and initiatives they've implemented, the skills they've taught other people.

I was speaking to a colleague a few days ago, who dodged the question as to whether or not they supported the death penalty, and instead brought up the issue that Andrew Chan had been involved in previous drug smuggling operations. The Daily Mail article above was referenced. Basically, they were questioning the sincerity of Andrew's rehabilitation and whether or not Andrew would've continued to run drugs overseas if he hadn't been caught. Well, we won't ever know these answers. But none of that matters a skerrick. At the time, I was like 'Yes, I see your point' and tried to argue against it, when what I really should've said was 'Shut up.' Because where does that sort of thinking get us? Other than a sense of smug superiority, I can't see that it achieves anything.

As I said, I've become more involved with things over the past few days, and I've met some of Andrew and Myu's friends. I know a bit more about these guys now, and their families, than simply how they've been presented in the media. I've seen what these people, their mates, are going through. And it's heartbreaking. Everyone, absolutely everyone close to these guys, is walking a knife's edge at the moment. There's no relief. The situation in Indonesia keeps changing. You can't be sure what'll happen next. But another thing, the stories these people were telling, their memories - it brought home to me that Andrew and Myu once had other lives besides Kerobokan prison, besides the drug operation. They're human, same as everyone else. They've got mates and family who love them. The stories I heard about them as teenagers were like reading over a familiar book where you remember everything that happened, even if you don't recall the exact wording - that is to say, it reminded me a lot of my own growing up and some of the s*** my mates said about me on my 18th. And I reckon it'd be the same for most people. They committed a bloody stupid act ten years ago. It doesn't make them monsters, or incapable of remorse, or incapable of change. And their families' hearts are breaking for them.

Andrew and Myu's rehabilitation is still an important issue - I think it will become critical in the following weeks if the Jakarta Admin Court uphold the latest appeal, as the onus will then be on President Widodo to explain why he rejected clemency, and he will likely have to take their rehabilitation and remorse into consideration. All I'm saying is that it no longer matters to me. I don't care what they've done; I just don't want them to die. I want peace for them, and their family and friends, who are going through hell. Also, look, you've probably seen the photos of them as kids being circulated, and people have responded by putting up photos of Jon Venables and s*** like that - and yeah, I see the point. Everyone was once a child, and being a child doesn't preclude you becoming a monster when you grow up. These guys aren't.

[am Bays]

Dear Indonesia

Please hurry up and shoot these F***ing toe rags!!

Make it painful and slow like the way you have prolonged this whole charade.

Sooner we get rid of those two degenerate low-life scum maybe we can focus on some real drug issue such assaults against Nurses and emergency service personnel as they deal with effect of the products these two dog turds tried to smuggle into this country.

Regards

Am bays

[RustyCage]

But they did grow up to be monsters. They grew up into people who forced others to smuggle drugs in countries that carry the death penalty for that crime, for their own financial gain.

Sure the threat of the bullet has straightened them up. Kudos to them for that.

I know that some people are blocking their ears and getting defensive/short/belittling with people who don't hold their own personal view, but does what they've done in jail change their crime? I know people are ignorantly pretending that these drugs are ok and fine to have on the streets, but is this really the case? Of course not.

I've a friend who is really close to these two guys, so I see what the friends and family are going through, and I really feel for them. I'd be happy if the executions didn't go ahead, for their sake. They don't deserve the pain they are going through. They've done nothing wrong. I'm sad for them.

[shoe boy]

Has one of these lads become a priest?
If this is so the lord will look after him.

[Booney]

But they did grow up to be monsters. They grew up into people who forced others to smuggle drugs in countries that carry the death penalty for that crime, for their own financial gain.

Sure the threat of the bullet has straightened them up. Kudos to them for that.

I know that some people are blocking their ears and getting defensive/short/belittling with people who don't hold their own personal view, but does what they've done in jail change their crime? I know people are ignorantly pretending that these drugs are ok and fine to have on the streets, but is this really the case? Of course not.

I've a friend who is really close to these two guys, so I see what the friends and family are going through, and I really feel for them. I'd be happy if the executions didn't go ahead, for their sake. They don't deserve the pain they are going through. They've done nothing wrong. I'm sad for them.

I say Woop, there it is.

[MW]

Dear Indonesia

Please hurry up and shoot these F***ing toe rags!!

Make it painful and slow like the way you have prolonged this whole charade.

Sooner we get rid of those two degenerate low-life scum maybe we can focus on some real drug issue such assaults against Nurses and emergency service personnel as they deal with effect of the products these two dog turds tried to smuggle into this country.

Regards

Am bays

A tad harsh don't you think

[Q.]

It's a broken and failing prison system that requires the threat of death as it's means to rehabilitate (and then murders them anyway).

[TEX07]

Up until last week I had more empathy for these guys - that was until I heard a mates child passed away from cancer, and read about the poor lad in the Barossa who died of a heart attack last week. These people get my empathy and not drug smugglers. I am not in favour of the death penalty, and agree these guys do not deserve it, but its not unfair, its unfortunate. If they hadnt been caught they would have done it again - the financial gain would gave been too much to refuse.

[Q.]

I didn't know that empathy was a finite resource.